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  #4  
Old 04-16-2009, 04:12 AM
Seth
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Default Re: Bond Interest for deceased

In article <gq8jnf$7dt$1[at]reader1.panix.com> , Seth <sethb[at]panix.com> wrote:
- quote -

> In article <gpbu2n$v7t$1[at]blue.rahul.net> ,
> Steve Pope <spope33[at]speedymail.org> wrote:
> > > On Mar 12, 8:42 am, Jeffrey <JHI3...[at]gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > > My Mother died in October of 2008. At that time she held corporate
> > > > bonds. The bonds are in the process of being redeemed, they all had a
> > > > death put clause. I have two questions regarding this situation:
> > > > > 1. The estate will get the full value of the bonds (death put), even
> > > > though some of them are selling for what she paid. Is there still a
> > > > capital gain?
> > > That depends on whether the bonds were amortized or not.
> > > If they are successfully put, or sold, there is a capital gain.


As of one second after death, those particular bonds (having the death
put) are worth par. So is the estate valued at the time of death, or
at the end of that day?

Seth

--
<< ------------------------------------------------------- > << The foregoing was not intended or written to be used, > << nor can it used, for the purpose of avoiding penalties > << that may be imposed upon the taxpayer. > << > << The Charter and the Guidelines for submitting posts > << to this newsgroup as well as our anti-spamming policy > << are at www.asktax.org. > << Copyright (2007) - All rights reserved. > << ------------------------------------------------------- >
  #3  
Old 03-23-2009, 05:31 PM
Bill Brown
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Default Re: Bond Interest for deceased

On Mar 23, 2:17*pm, se...[at]panix.com (Seth) wrote:

- quote -

> Wouldn't they be worth par as of the alternative (6 months after
> death) valuation date (especially if they've been put by then)?
> Seth


The alternative valuation date can only be elected (by the executor)
if both the taxable value of the estate and the estate tax are lower
on the alternative date.

--
<< ------------------------------------------------------- > << The foregoing was not intended or written to be used, > << nor can it used, for the purpose of avoiding penalties > << that may be imposed upon the taxpayer. > << > << The Charter and the Guidelines for submitting posts > << to this newsgroup as well as our anti-spamming policy > << are at www.asktax.org. > << Copyright (2007) - All rights reserved. > << ------------------------------------------------------- >
  #2  
Old 03-23-2009, 05:17 PM
Seth
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Default Re: Bond Interest for deceased

In article <gpbu2n$v7t$1[at]blue.rahul.net> ,
Steve Pope <spope33[at]speedymail.org> wrote:
- quote -

> > On Mar 12, 8:42 am, Jeffrey <JHI3...[at]gmail.com> wrote:
> > > My Mother died in October of 2008. At that time she held corporate
> > > bonds. The bonds are in the process of being redeemed, they all had a
> > > death put clause. I have two questions regarding this situation:
> > > 1. The estate will get the full value of the bonds (death put), even
> > > though some of them are selling for what she paid. Is there still a
> > > capital gain?


> > That depends on whether the bonds were amortized or not.

> If they are successfully put, or sold, there is a capital gain.
> The amortization election affects this gain.
> What I am wondering is if there's a step-up in basis possible.


Wouldn't they be worth par as of the alternative (6 months after
death) valuation date (especially if they've been put by then)?

Seth

--
<< ------------------------------------------------------- > << The foregoing was not intended or written to be used, > << nor can it used, for the purpose of avoiding penalties > << that may be imposed upon the taxpayer. > << > << The Charter and the Guidelines for submitting posts > << to this newsgroup as well as our anti-spamming policy > << are at www.asktax.org. > << Copyright (2007) - All rights reserved. > << ------------------------------------------------------- >
  #1  
Old 03-13-2009, 12:29 AM
Steve Pope
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Default Re: Bond Interest for deceased

removeps-groups[at]yahoo.com <removeps-groups[at]yahoo.com> wrote:

- quote -

> On Mar 12, 8:42 am, Jeffrey <JHI3...[at]gmail.com> wrote:

> > My Mother died in October of 2008. At that time she held corporate
> > bonds. The bonds are in the process of being redeemed, they all had a
> > death put clause. I have two questions regarding this situation:


> > 1. The estate will get the full value of the bonds (death put), even
> > though some of them are selling for what she paid. Is there still a
> > capital gain?


Tangentially, just because the bonds say "survivor put options" does
not mean you will be able to put them. Often the bond issuer
sets aside only a limited amount of funds to cover these puts,
and when those funds are used up, you cannot put the bonds.

- quote -

> That depends on whether the bonds were amortized or not.

If they are successfully put, or sold, there is a capital gain.
The amortization election affects this gain.

What I am wondering is if there's a step-up in basis possible.

Steve

--
<< ------------------------------------------------------- > << The foregoing was not intended or written to be used, > << nor can it used, for the purpose of avoiding penalties > << that may be imposed upon the taxpayer. > << > << The Charter and the Guidelines for submitting posts > << to this newsgroup as well as our anti-spamming policy > << are at www.asktax.org. > << Copyright (2007) - All rights reserved. > << ------------------------------------------------------- >
 
Old 03-12-2009, 05:41 PM
removeps-groups@yahoo.com
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Posts: n/a
Default Re: Bond Interest for deceased

On Mar 12, 8:42 am, Jeffrey <JHI3...[at]gmail.com> wrote:

- quote -

> My Mother died in October of 2008. At that time she held corporate
> bonds. The bonds are in the process of being redeemed, they all had a
> death put clause. I have two questions regarding this situation:
> 1. The estate will get the full value of the bonds (death put), even
> though some of them are selling for what she paid. Is there still a
> capital gain?


That depends on whether the bonds were amortized or not.

- quote -

> 2. The process liquidating her bonds takes time. The estate is still
> receiving the interest payments from these bonds (in 2009). How are
> these treated tax wise?


My understanding is that the trust needs to pay the tax. This is done
on form 1041. The table on page on page 27 of the instructions has
the rates. The rates are high, and the exemption of $600 is small.

You might need an expert to handle this thing.

http://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/i1041.pdf

--
<< ------------------------------------------------------- > << The foregoing was not intended or written to be used, > << nor can it used, for the purpose of avoiding penalties > << that may be imposed upon the taxpayer. > << > << The Charter and the Guidelines for submitting posts > << to this newsgroup as well as our anti-spamming policy > << are at www.asktax.org. > << Copyright (2007) - All rights reserved. > << ------------------------------------------------------- >
  #-1  
Old 03-12-2009, 02:42 PM
Jeffrey
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Posts: n/a
Default Bond Interest for deceased

My Mother died in October of 2008. At that time she held corporate
bonds. The bonds are in the process of being redeemed, they all had a
death put clause. I have two questions regarding this situation:

1. The estate will get the full value of the bonds (death put), even
though some of them are selling for what she paid. Is there still a
capital gain?

2. The process liquidating her bonds takes time. The estate is still
receiving the interest payments from these bonds (in 2009). How are
these treated tax wise?

Thanks.

Jeff

--
<< ------------------------------------------------------- > << The foregoing was not intended or written to be used, > << nor can it used, for the purpose of avoiding penalties > << that may be imposed upon the taxpayer. > << > << The Charter and the Guidelines for submitting posts > << to this newsgroup as well as our anti-spamming policy > << are at www.asktax.org. > << Copyright (2007) - All rights reserved. > << ------------------------------------------------------- >
 
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