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  #5  
Old 02-04-2009, 11:58 PM
ed
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: Is THIS a wash sale?

On Feb 4, 2:27*pm, "D. Stussy" <s...[at]bde-arc.ampr.org> wrote:
- quote -

> "Tom" <T...[at]cppc.com> wrote in message
> news:gmci4d$7kk$1[at]news.motzarella.org...
> > I had the following transactions:
> > 5/15/07 * * *Buy 500
> > 11/18/08 * *Buy 500
> > 12/8/08 * * *Sell 250 *Loss
> > 12/9/08 * * *Buy 250
> > 12/10/08 * *Sell *250 Loss
> > 12/11/08 * *Buy 250
> > 12/16/08 * *Sell 250 *Gain
> > 12/31/08 * *Sell 250 *Gain
> > 1/12/09 * * *Buy 200
> > 1/14/09 * * *Buy 150
> > 1/15/09 * * *Buy 100
> > Do I have any wash sales?
> > The way I see it, I created wash sales with my purchases on 12/9 and

> 12/11,
> > but terminated them with my sales for profit on 12/16/08 and 12/31.

> But
> > what do I know.

> 2 wash sales. *However, you might not have terminated them by sale. *They
> are terminated only if you used LIFO or specifically indicated which lots
> you were selling at a gain (a written instruction to your broker is needed
> to prove that). *If you didn't do that, they are still there as an increase
> to basis of shares you still have.
> --
> << ------------------------------------------------------- > > << The foregoing was not intended or written to be used, * > > << nor can it used, for the purpose of avoiding penalties *> > << that may be imposed upon the taxpayer. * * * * * * * * *> > << * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * > > << * The Charter and the Guidelines for submitting posts * > > << *to this newsgroup as well as our anti-spamming policy *> > << * * * * * * * * *are atwww.asktax.org. * * * * * * * * > > << * * * * Copyright (2007) - All rights reserved. * * * * > > << ------------------------------------------------------- > > - Hide quoted text -
> - Show quoted text -


Steve Pop said: No, as far as I know there is no concept of
"terminating" a wash
sale in this manner. Because of the 12/9 and 12/11 washes,
right after 12/11 your basis in the shares is determined by
the 2007 and 11/18/08 purchases. These form the bases for
the 12/16 and 12/31 sales. (If using FIFO, it's the 2007 basis
for both.)

Oddly the 2007 purchase are the shares sold to create the wash sales.
Their replacement shares of 11/18/08 took on the 2007 date, making
them the FIFO shares which are sold to negate the Wash Sales. In
other words, all the Replacment Shares carrying Wash Sale losses are
sold. Everything else is a purchase and no bearing on this.

--
<< ------------------------------------------------------- > << The foregoing was not intended or written to be used, > << nor can it used, for the purpose of avoiding penalties > << that may be imposed upon the taxpayer. > << > << The Charter and the Guidelines for submitting posts > << to this newsgroup as well as our anti-spamming policy > << are at www.asktax.org. > << Copyright (2007) - All rights reserved. > << ------------------------------------------------------- >
  #4  
Old 02-04-2009, 11:45 PM
ed
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: Is THIS a wash sale?

On Feb 4, 2:27*pm, "D. Stussy" <s...[at]bde-arc.ampr.org> wrote:
- quote -

> "Tom" <T...[at]cppc.com> wrote in message
> news:gmci4d$7kk$1[at]news.motzarella.org...
> > I had the following transactions:
> > 5/15/07 * * *Buy 500
> > 11/18/08 * *Buy 500
> > 12/8/08 * * *Sell 250 *Loss
> > 12/9/08 * * *Buy 250
> > 12/10/08 * *Sell *250 Loss
> > 12/11/08 * *Buy 250
> > 12/16/08 * *Sell 250 *Gain
> > 12/31/08 * *Sell 250 *Gain
> > 1/12/09 * * *Buy 200
> > 1/14/09 * * *Buy 150
> > 1/15/09 * * *Buy 100
> > Do I have any wash sales?
> > The way I see it, I created wash sales with my purchases on 12/9 and

> 12/11,
> > but terminated them with my sales for profit on 12/16/08 and 12/31.

> But
> > what do I know.

> 2 wash sales. *However, you might not have terminated them by sale. *They
> are terminated only if you used LIFO or specifically indicated which lots
> you were selling at a gain (a written instruction to your broker is needed
> to prove that). *If you didn't do that, they are still there as an increase
> to basis of shares you still have.
> --
> << ------------------------------------------------------- > > << The foregoing was not intended or written to be used, * > > << nor can it used, for the purpose of avoiding penalties *> > << that may be imposed upon the taxpayer. * * * * * * * * *> > << * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * > > << * The Charter and the Guidelines for submitting posts * > > << *to this newsgroup as well as our anti-spamming policy *> > << * * * * * * * * *are atwww.asktax.org. * * * * * * * * > > << * * * * Copyright (2007) - All rights reserved. * * * * > > << ------------------------------------------------------- > > - Hide quoted text -
> - Show quoted text -


Thisis how I see this problem:

5/15/07 Buy 500
- quote -

> 11/18/08 Buy 500
> 12/8/08 Sell 250 Loss This is a WS because you replaced on 11/18 The 11/18 shares take on the loss and date of the 5/15/07 shares
> 12/9/08 Buy 250
> 12/10/08 Sell 250 Loss This is a WS by replacement of 11/18/08, taking on loss and date of the remaiining 5/15/07 shares
> 12/11/08 Buy 250
> 12/16/08 Sell 250 Gain . You sold the first WS but with the loss it inherited, was it still a gain?
> 12/31/08 Sell 250 Gain You sold the second WS but with the loss it inherited, was it still a gain?
> 1/12/09 Buy 200
> 1/14/09 Buy 150
> 1/15/09 Buy 100

Per the above you might not have any wash sales left, or you might,
depending on whether your two sells are a gain after absorbing the
losses of the WSs

ed

--
<< ------------------------------------------------------- > << The foregoing was not intended or written to be used, > << nor can it used, for the purpose of avoiding penalties > << that may be imposed upon the taxpayer. > << > << The Charter and the Guidelines for submitting posts > << to this newsgroup as well as our anti-spamming policy > << are at www.asktax.org. > << Copyright (2007) - All rights reserved. > << ------------------------------------------------------- >
  #3  
Old 02-04-2009, 11:27 PM
ed
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: Is THIS a wash sale?

On Feb 4, 2:27*pm, "D. Stussy" <s...[at]bde-arc.ampr.org> wrote:
- quote -

> "Tom" <T...[at]cppc.com> wrote in message
> news:gmci4d$7kk$1[at]news.motzarella.org...
> > I had the following transactions:
> > 5/15/07 * * *Buy 500
> > 11/18/08 * *Buy 500
> > 12/8/08 * * *Sell 250 *Loss
> > 12/9/08 * * *Buy 250
> > 12/10/08 * *Sell *250 Loss
> > 12/11/08 * *Buy 250
> > 12/16/08 * *Sell 250 *Gain
> > 12/31/08 * *Sell 250 *Gain
> > 1/12/09 * * *Buy 200
> > 1/14/09 * * *Buy 150
> > 1/15/09 * * *Buy 100
> > Do I have any wash sales?
> > The way I see it, I created wash sales with my purchases on 12/9 and

> 12/11,
> > but terminated them with my sales for profit on 12/16/08 and 12/31.

> But
> > what do I know.

> 2 wash sales. *However, you might not have terminated them by sale. *They
> are terminated only if you used LIFO or specifically indicated which lots
> you were selling at a gain (a written instruction to your broker is needed
> to prove that). *If you didn't do that, they are still there as an increase
> to basis of shares you still have.
> --
> << ------------------------------------------------------- > > << The foregoing was not intended or written to be used, * > > << nor can it used, for the purpose of avoiding penalties *> > << that may be imposed upon the taxpayer. * * * * * * * * *> > << * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * > > << * The Charter and the Guidelines for submitting posts * > > << *to this newsgroup as well as our anti-spamming policy *> > << * * * * * * * * *are atwww.asktax.org. * * * * * * * * > > << * * * * Copyright (2007) - All rights reserved. * * * * > > << ------------------------------------------------------- > > - Hide quoted text -
> - Show quoted text -


Yes, you had two wash sales you identified, but they were negated by
selling the two replacement shares \. In wash sale land everything is
FIFO (except specific identification of which replacement shares are
sold) and the replacement shares take on the buy-date of the wash sale
shares, making them the FIFO shares, usually.

ed

--
<< ------------------------------------------------------- > << The foregoing was not intended or written to be used, > << nor can it used, for the purpose of avoiding penalties > << that may be imposed upon the taxpayer. > << > << The Charter and the Guidelines for submitting posts > << to this newsgroup as well as our anti-spamming policy > << are at www.asktax.org. > << Copyright (2007) - All rights reserved. > << ------------------------------------------------------- >
  #2  
Old 02-04-2009, 07:27 PM
D. Stussy
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: Is THIS a wash sale?

"Tom" <Tom[at]cppc.com> wrote in message
news:gmci4d$7kk$1[at]news.motzarella.org...
- quote -

> I had the following transactions:
> 5/15/07 Buy 500
> 11/18/08 Buy 500
> 12/8/08 Sell 250 Loss
> 12/9/08 Buy 250
> 12/10/08 Sell 250 Loss
> 12/11/08 Buy 250
> 12/16/08 Sell 250 Gain
> 12/31/08 Sell 250 Gain
> 1/12/09 Buy 200
> 1/14/09 Buy 150
> 1/15/09 Buy 100
> Do I have any wash sales?
> The way I see it, I created wash sales with my purchases on 12/9 and

12/11,
> but terminated them with my sales for profit on 12/16/08 and 12/31.

But
> what do I know.


2 wash sales. However, you might not have terminated them by sale. They
are terminated only if you used LIFO or specifically indicated which lots
you were selling at a gain (a written instruction to your broker is needed
to prove that). If you didn't do that, they are still there as an increase
to basis of shares you still have.

--
<< ------------------------------------------------------- > << The foregoing was not intended or written to be used, > << nor can it used, for the purpose of avoiding penalties > << that may be imposed upon the taxpayer. > << > << The Charter and the Guidelines for submitting posts > << to this newsgroup as well as our anti-spamming policy > << are at www.asktax.org. > << Copyright (2007) - All rights reserved. > << ------------------------------------------------------- >
  #1  
Old 02-04-2009, 07:26 PM
Steve Pope
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: Is THIS a wash sale?

Tom <Tom[at]cppc.com> wrote:

- quote -

> I had the following transactions:

> 5/15/07 Buy 500
> 11/18/08 Buy 500
> 12/8/08 Sell 250 Loss
> 12/9/08 Buy 250
> 12/10/08 Sell 250 Loss
> 12/11/08 Buy 250
> 12/16/08 Sell 250 Gain
> 12/31/08 Sell 250 Gain
> 1/12/09 Buy 200
> 1/14/09 Buy 150
> 1/15/09 Buy 100


> Do I have any wash sales?


Yes

- quote -

> The way I see it, I created wash sales with my purchases on 12/9
> and 12/11,


Correct

- quote -

> but terminated them with my sales for profit on 12/16/08 and 12/31.

No, as far as I know there is no concept of "terminating" a wash
sale in this manner. Because of the 12/9 and 12/11 washes,
right after 12/11 your basis in the shares is determined by
the 2007 and 11/18/08 purchases. These form the bases for
the 12/16 and 12/31 sales. (If using FIFO, it's the 2007 basis
for both.)

Steve

--
<< ------------------------------------------------------- > << The foregoing was not intended or written to be used, > << nor can it used, for the purpose of avoiding penalties > << that may be imposed upon the taxpayer. > << > << The Charter and the Guidelines for submitting posts > << to this newsgroup as well as our anti-spamming policy > << are at www.asktax.org. > << Copyright (2007) - All rights reserved. > << ------------------------------------------------------- >
 
Old 02-04-2009, 06:19 PM
Phil Marti
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: Is THIS a wash sale?

"Tom" wrote:

- quote -

> I had the following transactions:
> 5/15/07 Buy 500
> 11/18/08 Buy 500
> 12/8/08 Sell 250 Loss--This is a wash sale.
> 12/9/08 Buy 250
> 12/10/08 Sell 250 Loss--This is a wash sale
> 12/11/08 Buy 250
> 12/16/08 Sell 250 Gain
> 12/31/08 Sell 250 Gain
> 1/12/09 Buy 200
> 1/14/09 Buy 150
> 1/15/09 Buy 100


--
Phil Marti
Clarksburg, MD

--
<< ------------------------------------------------------- > << The foregoing was not intended or written to be used, > << nor can it used, for the purpose of avoiding penalties > << that may be imposed upon the taxpayer. > << > << The Charter and the Guidelines for submitting posts > << to this newsgroup as well as our anti-spamming policy > << are at www.asktax.org. > << Copyright (2007) - All rights reserved. > << ------------------------------------------------------- >
  #-1  
Old 02-04-2009, 06:02 PM
Tom
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Is THIS a wash sale?

I had the following transactions:

5/15/07 Buy 500
11/18/08 Buy 500
12/8/08 Sell 250 Loss
12/9/08 Buy 250
12/10/08 Sell 250 Loss
12/11/08 Buy 250
12/16/08 Sell 250 Gain
12/31/08 Sell 250 Gain
1/12/09 Buy 200
1/14/09 Buy 150
1/15/09 Buy 100

Do I have any wash sales?
The way I see it, I created wash sales with my purchases on 12/9 and 12/11,
but terminated them with my sales for profit on 12/16/08 and 12/31. But
what do I know.

--
<< ------------------------------------------------------- > << The foregoing was not intended or written to be used, > << nor can it used, for the purpose of avoiding penalties > << that may be imposed upon the taxpayer. > << > << The Charter and the Guidelines for submitting posts > << to this newsgroup as well as our anti-spamming policy > << are at www.asktax.org. > << Copyright (2007) - All rights reserved. > << ------------------------------------------------------- >
 
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