Stuart A. Bronstein wrote:
- quote -

against the law? Well now, remember that IRS has contracted
with several outside collection agencies already to try and
collect certain types of taxes.

However the jury is still out on the efficacy of such and
many tax pros thinks that it's just a matter of time before
such collection efforts will be "contracted in" again.

ChEAr$,
Harlan Lunsford, EA n LA

<< ================================================== ===== > << The foregoing was not intended or written to be used, > << nor can it used, for the purpose of avoiding penalties > << that may be imposed upon the taxpayer. > << > << The Charter and the Guidelines for submitting posts > << to this newsgroup as well as our anti-spamming policy > << are at www.asktax.org. > << Copyright (2006) - All rights reserved. > << ================================================== ===== >

"Stuart A. Bronstein" wrote....

- quote -

Yes, for the moment.

A new program: Private Debt Collection Program may be the
beginning of the end for civil service clerical workers
keying in data.

Congress may pass legislation to end that which they
previously mandated {allowing more Government work to be
let-out to private contractors} OTOH, a few tweaks in the
disclosure regs/laws/procs would allow it to happen.

<http://www.irs.gov/businesses/small/...155136,00.html
<< ================================================== ===== > << The foregoing was not intended or written to be used, > << nor can it used, for the purpose of avoiding penalties > << that may be imposed upon the taxpayer. > << > << The Charter and the Guidelines for submitting posts > << to this newsgroup as well as our anti-spamming policy > << are at www.asktax.org. > << Copyright (2006) - All rights reserved. > << ================================================== ===== >

"Taxmanhog" <taxmanhog[at]comcast.net> wrote:

- quote -

I don't know that they could legitimately subcontract (in
the country or outside) any functions that would include
having access to tax return information. It's against the
law for them to disclose that information, after all.

Stu

<< ================================================== ===== > << The foregoing was not intended or written to be used, > << nor can it used, for the purpose of avoiding penalties > << that may be imposed upon the taxpayer. > << > << The Charter and the Guidelines for submitting posts > << to this newsgroup as well as our anti-spamming policy > << are at www.asktax.org. > << Copyright (2006) - All rights reserved. > << ================================================== ===== >

- quote -

The OP is confusing the return preparation of returns for
accounting/cpa/tax prep houses.

A couple of years ago there was a weekly news hour program
exposé on the process.

All the sources doc's, (W-2, 1099, etc) are scanned & secure
emailed to an accounting sweat shop in the south Asia.

They review the doc's then prepare DRAFT return &
schedules, they secure email the returns the USA CPA who
presents the documents to their client for filing, usually
on paper to the IRS, but possibly some are E-filed.

The IRS has not YET subcontracted the keying of data to
NGO's either within or outside the USA. The day may come on
that, no official site, just my humble opinion.

<< ================================================== ===== > << The foregoing was not intended or written to be used, > << nor can it used, for the purpose of avoiding penalties > << that may be imposed upon the taxpayer. > << > << The Charter and the Guidelines for submitting posts > << to this newsgroup as well as our anti-spamming policy > << are at www.asktax.org. > << Copyright (2006) - All rights reserved. > << ================================================== ===== >

- quote -

I wasn't suggesting that the software should be free. Just
that some enterprising vendor would include enough free
e-files to satisfy the normal user. (as you state below.)
They would still make money from selling their software.

- quote -

I agree.

- quote -

Or extra charges at hotels for making a "800" number
telephone call :-)

--
Vic Roberts
Replace xxx with vdr in e-mail address.

<< ================================================== ===== > << The foregoing was not intended or written to be used, > << nor can it used, for the purpose of avoiding penalties > << that may be imposed upon the taxpayer. > << > << The Charter and the Guidelines for submitting posts > << to this newsgroup as well as our anti-spamming policy > << are at www.asktax.org. > << Copyright (2006) - All rights reserved. > << ================================================== ===== >

- quote -

Your sources are wrong. The savings is about $1.60 per
return for e-filing versus paper. See my cites elsewhere in
this thread.

I don't have a cite but I don't think returns are sent
overseas by IRS for keypunching.

--
Drew Edmundson, CPA
Cary, NC

<< ================================================== ===== > << The foregoing was not intended or written to be used, > << nor can it used, for the purpose of avoiding penalties > << that may be imposed upon the taxpayer. > << > << The Charter and the Guidelines for submitting posts > << to this newsgroup as well as our anti-spamming policy > << are at www.asktax.org. > << Copyright (2006) - All rights reserved. > << ================================================== ===== >

Drew Edmundson <drewsbeagles[at]hotmail.com> wrote:
- quote -

PC Magazine quotes an unnamed IRS official that the savings
from e-filing is $1.60 per return. Was in the most recent
issue where they reviewed online filing.

--
Drew Edmundson, CPA
Cary, NC

<< ================================================== ===== > << The foregoing was not intended or written to be used, > << nor can it used, for the purpose of avoiding penalties > << that may be imposed upon the taxpayer. > << > << The Charter and the Guidelines for submitting posts > << to this newsgroup as well as our anti-spamming policy > << are at www.asktax.org. > << Copyright (2006) - All rights reserved. > << ================================================== ===== >

- quote -

I don't think it is fair to expect private businesses to
provide services for free. It costs them money to modify
their software to use electronic filing. Due to law changes
and form changes, this is an annual thing. On the other
hand, I believe they could charge less and still make a good
profit.

To be honest I think their best bet would be to just include
it in the price of the software, adjusting that price
appropriately. Those that don't e-file would be subsidizing
every one else but that is common in other businesses.
Believe it or not, some people don't eat the "free" bread at
Macaroni Grill.

All the add-on pricing also bothers me but it is common.
Why does the $49.99 tire always end up costing about $60?
The $79.99 cell phone bill is about $86.

--
Drew Edmundson, CPA
Cary, NC

<< ================================================== ===== > << The foregoing was not intended or written to be used, > << nor can it used, for the purpose of avoiding penalties > << that may be imposed upon the taxpayer. > << > << The Charter and the Guidelines for submitting posts > << to this newsgroup as well as our anti-spamming policy > << are at www.asktax.org. > << Copyright (2006) - All rights reserved. > << ================================================== ===== >

- quote -

I read someehere it costs the IRS $6 per page to scan a
printed tax return and $9 per page to have some offshore
clerk keypuch in a hand printed return. So they are
spending $54 dollars on my return to avoid $15. Thats
pretty typical for the feds. I spending 63 cents to avoid
$15.

<< ================================================== ===== > << The foregoing was not intended or written to be used, > << nor can it used, for the purpose of avoiding penalties > << that may be imposed upon the taxpayer. > << > << The Charter and the Guidelines for submitting posts > << to this newsgroup as well as our anti-spamming policy > << are at www.asktax.org. > << Copyright (2006) - All rights reserved. > << ================================================== ===== >

"Taxmanhog" <taxmanhog[at]comcast.net> wrote:
- quote -

Thank you for taking the time to respond. I see on page 5
an increased savings from e-filing of $6,479,000 for an
additional 4,200,000 returns e-filed instead of on paper.
This works out to $1.54 per return. Better than the 14
cents from 1999 but still nothing to get excited about.
Plus it includes a half million business returns which are
probably a larger savings than the 1040s.

So for 133 million individual returns we have a savings of
about $205 million. Not small potatoes to you and me but
not even a drop in the bucket to the government. To me the
real money will be when IRS can access all the extra
information that comes in electronically beyond what is
input from a paper filing. Then they should be able to
perform additional analysis to detect errors, fraud, etc.

Again, thank you for the link.

--
Drew Edmundson, CPA
Cary, NC

<< ================================================== ===== > << The foregoing was not intended or written to be used, > << nor can it used, for the purpose of avoiding penalties > << that may be imposed upon the taxpayer. > << > << The Charter and the Guidelines for submitting posts > << to this newsgroup as well as our anti-spamming policy > << are at www.asktax.org. > << Copyright (2006) - All rights reserved. > << ================================================== ===== >

Drew Edmundson <drewsbeagles[at]hotmail.com> wrote:

[snip]

- quote -

Good point! There is nothing preventing any of the tax prep
software vendors from providing free unlimited e-file with
their products.

--
Vic Roberts
Replace xxx with vdr in e-mail address.

<< ================================================== ===== > << The foregoing was not intended or written to be used, > << nor can it used, for the purpose of avoiding penalties > << that may be imposed upon the taxpayer. > << > << The Charter and the Guidelines for submitting posts > << to this newsgroup as well as our anti-spamming policy > << are at www.asktax.org. > << Copyright (2006) - All rights reserved. > << ================================================== ===== >

"Drew Edmundson" wrote

- quote -

The commissioners FY08 budget request overview, provides some
detail.

http://www.irs.gov/pub/newsroom/budg...brief-2008.pdf

<< ================================================== ===== > << The foregoing was not intended or written to be used, > << nor can it used, for the purpose of avoiding penalties > << that may be imposed upon the taxpayer. > << > << The Charter and the Guidelines for submitting posts > << to this newsgroup as well as our anti-spamming policy > << are at www.asktax.org. > << Copyright (2006) - All rights reserved. > << ================================================== ===== >

- quote -

Isn't this what we have now? The format is published and
freely available to anyone wanting to use it. The only
hurdle you don't mention is the testing IRS requires before
the software can be used to file with them.

My point is that the savings for the government aren't worth
the entire e-filing process unless something has
significantly changed since 1999. Even at 100% savings is
less than $5 a return.

--
Drew Edmundson, CPA
Cary, NC

<< ================================================== ===== > << The foregoing was not intended or written to be used, > << nor can it used, for the purpose of avoiding penalties > << that may be imposed upon the taxpayer. > << > << The Charter and the Guidelines for submitting posts > << to this newsgroup as well as our anti-spamming policy > << are at www.asktax.org. > << Copyright (2006) - All rights reserved. > << ================================================== ===== >

"Taxmanhog" <taxmanhog[at]comcast.net> wrote:
- quote -

"Drew Edmundson" wrote...
- quote -

Even more than the $4.28 to process the paper returns?
Please provide statistics or a link. (Please note I asked
nicely, if you don't have a link handy and don't want to "do
my research for me" then please just ignore the request).

--
Drew Edmundson, CPA
Cary, NC

<< ================================================== ===== > << The foregoing was not intended or written to be used, > << nor can it used, for the purpose of avoiding penalties > << that may be imposed upon the taxpayer. > << > << The Charter and the Guidelines for submitting posts > << to this newsgroup as well as our anti-spamming policy > << are at www.asktax.org. > << Copyright (2006) - All rights reserved. > << ================================================== ===== >

- quote -

First, I make my Federal tax payments on-line for no charge
using EFTPS and it works very well. Second, I file Forms
W-2 and W-3 on-line for no charge at www.ssa.gov and that
works well also.

Second, no one is saying that the Federal government needs
to write any software. All they need to do is establish a
data format and secure data exchange standard (something
that NIST does very well) for use by taxpayers using
commercial tax preparation software. They don't even have
to require that people selling tax prep software make their
tax prep software compatible with the new, free, data format
and data exchange interface, they just have to make it
available. Some software companies will choose to make
their e-file function compatible with the new free interface
while others may not. We can then allow the free market to
take care of the rest.

--
Vic Roberts
Replace xxx with vdr in e-mail address.

<< ================================================== ===== > << The foregoing was not intended or written to be used, > << nor can it used, for the purpose of avoiding penalties > << that may be imposed upon the taxpayer. > << > << The Charter and the Guidelines for submitting posts > << to this newsgroup as well as our anti-spamming policy > << are at www.asktax.org. > << Copyright (2006) - All rights reserved. > << ================================================== ===== >

Taxmanhog wrote:
- quote -

How much of that perceived "savings" is due to ERO's picking
up the considerable cost of maintaining a mid-tier computing
and networking infrastructure?

After all, when I get a confirmation e-mail that my e-filed
return has been received and accepted by the IRS, it doesn't
come from the IRS. Who do you think pays for that?

-Mark Bole

<< ================================================== ===== > << The foregoing was not intended or written to be used, > << nor can it used, for the purpose of avoiding penalties > << that may be imposed upon the taxpayer. > << > << The Charter and the Guidelines for submitting posts > << to this newsgroup as well as our anti-spamming policy > << are at www.asktax.org. > << Copyright (2006) - All rights reserved. > << ================================================== ===== >

"Taxmanhog" <taxmanhog[at]comcast.net> wrote:

- quote -

In other words, the more successful the e-file campaign is,
the more resources the IRS devotes to collection and audit.

So in exchange for the "warm and fuzzy" one gets by making
the tax system more efficient for everyone and saving the
nation a few cents each return, one must balance the
increased personal risk of an audit which will cost one many
hundreds of $$$s simply to prepare for.

<< ================================================== ===== > << The foregoing was not intended or written to be used, > << nor can it used, for the purpose of avoiding penalties > << that may be imposed upon the taxpayer. > << > << The Charter and the Guidelines for submitting posts > << to this newsgroup as well as our anti-spamming policy > << are at www.asktax.org. > << Copyright (2006) - All rights reserved. > << ================================================== ===== >

"Ray" wrote:
- quote -

"Drew Edmundson" wrote...
- quote -

Ancient history.....The savings are manifest in other ways.

Over the past 7 or less years.

The clerks & TE's who were involved on processing paper
returns in many centers were either laid off, or given
meaningful replacement work, many in customer services,
account adjustments, collection & Exam support centralized
case processing.

Many Area (fka District) offices reduced forces of the
equivalent laborers to the centralized sites.

In the long run the Service ~is~ saving more money than what
is represented above.

<< ================================================== ===== > << The foregoing was not intended or written to be used, > << nor can it used, for the purpose of avoiding penalties > << that may be imposed upon the taxpayer. > << > << The Charter and the Guidelines for submitting posts > << to this newsgroup as well as our anti-spamming policy > << are at www.asktax.org. > << Copyright (2006) - All rights reserved. > << ================================================== ===== >

Drew Edmundson wrote:

- quote -

I've never been a supporter of allowing private enterprise a
free reign to charge customers for government mandated
functions, but given IRS's record in software production, do
we really want them in the tax prep software business? Last
I heard, IRS personnel were still using commercial software
(Tax Wise) for tax return prep.

<< ================================================== ===== > << The foregoing was not intended or written to be used, > << nor can it used, for the purpose of avoiding penalties > << that may be imposed upon the taxpayer. > << > << The Charter and the Guidelines for submitting posts > << to this newsgroup as well as our anti-spamming policy > << are at www.asktax.org. > << Copyright (2006) - All rights reserved. > << ================================================== ===== >

Drew Edmundson <drewsbeagles[at]hotmail.com> wrote:

- quote -

A mandate to reduce the exceptions and special regulations
by 15% of current, each year for at least 8 years should get
us to a more equitable and simpler tax code rather fast. Or
just eliminate all special circumstances.

I'm sure I would not be able to prepare tax returns by
myself in my current situation, if I hadn't started filing
in 1970. I moved to the US in 1969.

--
Best regards
Han
email address is invalid

<< ================================================== ===== > << The foregoing was not intended or written to be used, > << nor can it used, for the purpose of avoiding penalties > << that may be imposed upon the taxpayer. > << > << The Charter and the Guidelines for submitting posts > << to this newsgroup as well as our anti-spamming policy > << are at www.asktax.org. > << Copyright (2006) - All rights reserved. > << ================================================== ===== >