Stuart Bronstein wrote:
- quote -

Maybe there are such "experts" around, somewhere, perhaps
even at the game. However, since we define fair market
value as what "a willing buyer would pay a willing seller",
(neither being under compunction to trade), even if you
have willing buyers, without a willing seller (Mankiewiez.,
something like that,,...) no value can be established. Like
Mike said, "until he decides to sell the ball, i.e. become a
willing seller,....."

(Heh heh!)

ChEAr$,
Harlan Lunsford, EA n LA
Fri, 14 Jan 2005

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- quote -

And baseball is an odd sort of ball game anyway.

It's one of the few ball games where the ball is given to,
and controlled by the defense.

__
Art Kamlet ArtKamlet [at] AOL.com Columbus OH K2PZH

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"Seth Breidbart" <sethb[at]panix.com> wrote:
- quote -

Well it depends on whose signature he got, and to whom he
presented the autographed ball to. If it was Pedro
Martinez's signature, it's worthless as the ball got thrown
under the bus by him just like the rest of the team. If it
was Curt Schilling on the other hand, then it's priceless
because some personal qualities aren't simply measured by
the value of the dollar.

--
David M. Woods, EA, ChFC, CLU
Woods Financial Services
Norwood, MA 02062
www.woods-financial.com

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"Alan" <tempuser[at]vacationmail.com> wrote:
- quote -

True, however in the postseason, different balls are used.
They aren't standard MLB balls, they are decorated with the
postseason logo.

--
David M. Woods, EA, ChFC, CLU
Woods Financial Services
Norwood, MA 02062
www.woods-financial.com

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Mike Lewis <jmpj[at]cableone.net> wrote:

- quote -

Of _that particular_ USED baseball, which is a hell of a lot
more than the usual worn-out used baseball.

- quote -

He isn't a dealer in collectibles, but as a ballplayer he
(hypothetically) comes into possession of such relatively
rare baseballs often.

Now let's make it worse: After coming into possession of
it, he got his teammates to autograph it. This increased
its value, of course; but that increase isn't taxable until
realized.

Or, what if he signed it, and not his teammates? Would the
increase in value due to his signature be ordinary income?
Would it matter whether it was held for a year after he
signed it?

Seth

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"Harlan Lunsford" <hnslunsford[at]bellsouth.net> wrote:
- quote -

Here's the bill for the dinner. MLB owns the balls,
not the teams. MLB claimed Mientkewicz owns the ball.

--
David M. Woods, EA, ChFC, CLU
Woods Financial Services
Norwood, MA 02062
www.woods-financial.com

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Harlan Lunsford wrote:
- quote -

The rules of major league baseball require that the home
team supply all the baseballs to be used in any game. Each
league specifies how many. They must all be sealed and
turned over to the umpiring crew who are responsible for
breaking the seal, inspecting the balls and ensuring that
they are fit for play.

Next time you watch a game, note that the home plate umpire
always gets new balls from the home team dugout.

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Dick Adams wrote:

- quote -

If you love baseball statistics be sure to read "The Numbers
Game" by Alan Schwarz (2004). It is a well written history
of how baseball statistics have changed over the years.

--
Alan
http://taxtopics.net

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Mike Lewis wrote:

- quote -

I agree except with one thing. The moment it's caught it's
the final out and final ball of the game. At that point
it's got value, and there are tons of (or so they claim to
be) experts who will venture to give a value to the ball.

Stu

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Dick Adams wrote:

- quote -

And A WAY we GO!!!

First question. Which team owned the ball before it was
thrown by the Red Sox pitcher? Did the Red Sox bring their
own balls from Boston to use against the Cards? Or did the
host team supply all balls?

Food for thought.

ChEAr$,
Harlan Lunsford, EA n LA
Sun, 9 Jan 2005

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"Dick Adams" <rdadams[at]smart.net> wrote:

- quote -

I'll just point out that the ball is property of MLB, not
the Red Sox or the Cardinals, and MLB said it was
Mietnkewicz's ball. I think that ends things right there.

--
David M. Woods, EA, ChFC, CLU
Woods Financial Services
Norwood, MA 02062
www.woods-financial.com

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"Dick Adams" <rdadams[at]smart.net> wrote:

- quote -

Unless the guy was an actual employee of the BRS, and even
if he was,.....the max anyone could say he should report in
the year of catch is the fair market value of the USED
baseball (my humble opinion). Until he sells such ball, the
actual fmv of the ball is impossible to estimate. If he
holds it over one year (assuming he is not a dealer in
collectibles), to me its a capital gain.

Mike Lewis, CPA

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On the second Saturday of every month, I attempt to attend
the 9 am meeting of "Talkin Baseball". For those who have
not read this before: "The four great loves of my life are
women, children, Baseball, and statistics. In the first
two. I have years of experience. In the latter two, I
actually know things of value."

This month the speaker was Tim Kurkjian of ESPN and he
raised an interesting issue. The last out of the 2004
World Series was a ground out by Edgar Renteria to pitcher
Keith Foulke to first baseman Doug Mientkiewicz.

My position was, is, and remains that a baseball caught by
a fan is NOT found treasure, NO taxes are owned until sold,
and if held over one year. the sale of the ball is subject
to capital gains taxes.

BUT WAIT!! Mr. Mientkiewicz is NOT a FAN. He was at the
moment he came into the possession of the baseball an
employee of the Boston Red Sox. First, because of his
employee status, I believe the ball is the property of the
Boston Red Sox. But that is civil law issue and not of
relevance in this newsgroup.

What is relevant is (1) he has held the ball since October
27, 2004 - when the Boston Red Sox won the World Series for
the first time since 1918 and (2) he is holding it for sale.

I still do not want to classify this ball as found treasure.
If his employer allows him to keep it, it appears to me to
be a bonus for the 2004 tax year. I do not know where the
gentleman lives, but since he plays for Boston and came into
possession of the ball in St. Louis, this bonus could be
subject to taxation in up to three States.

And who said I wasn't flexible about constructive receipt??

Dick

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