- quote -

Ah, see, you must be looking at Pub 970 for 2002, which does
contain this text. The 2003 version does not; it makes no
mention of what qualified related expenses might be "in
general", but only says that "certain" related expenses
qualify, implying that there are other related expenses
which, although required for attendance or enrollment, do
not. Some of these nonqualified expenses are listed later,
but whether this is a complete list is left up to the
imagination.

<snip
- quote -

Oh, certainly it is one of those; however, only "certain" of
those expenses qualify according to the 2003 Pub 970, and we
aren't told exactly which ones.

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- quote -

I thought I had already cited the source:
However, to clarify: Pub 970, "Tax Benefits for Education"
.... After changes, reminder and inroduction, the first
numbered "chapter" [though not designated as such] is for
the Hope Credit. The second, number 2, has a main title of
"Lifetime Learning Credit."

In this chapter, a major heading is "What Expenses Qualify?"
and directly below that heading, appears the following:
"The lifetime learning credit is based on qualified tuition
and related expenses you pay for yourself, your spouse, or a
dependent for whom you claim an examption on your tax
return."

The next bold subhead is: "Qualified Tuition and Related
Expenses" -- with a first paragraph below, which starts as
follows: "In general, qualified tuition and related
expenses are tuition and fees required for enrollment in a
course at an eligible educational institution."

Those are, again, direct quotes from the IRS publication.
My next sentence was a reference back to the query by the
original poster who referred to "application fees" as being
part of tuition and related expenses, in his post.

- quote -

You may be right. Who knows what "lurks in the hearts of
men" who write tax laws, regulations and court opinions?
But, I believe I observed that a "prudent man" _might
reasonably conclude that the "Application Fee" _required to
enroll_ was necessarily an expense which could be considered
"related" to tuition.

I was, after all, expressing an opinion when I said, "that
would be enough for *me* [indicated italics added] to
conclude ..."

Should I have said "prudent person"? <G
Bill

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- quote -

I can't find that sentence in the Lifetime Learning Credit
section of Pub 970. Can you provide the page number,
subheading, and paragraph? I do see that the following are
mentioned as qualified expenses:

"certain related expenses required for enrollment in a
course" (Note: CERTAIN expenses, not ANY expenses)

"student activity fees and expenses for course-related
books, supplies, and equipment . . . if they must be paid to
the institution as a condition of enrollment or attendance"

I don't see anything else to tell us what else those
"certain" expenses might include. From this I would
conclude that the ONLY expenses that qualify for the
Lifetime Learning Credit are:

1. Tuition
2. Qualified student activity fees
3. Qualified course-related books, supplies, and equipment

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- quote -

Okay then, I'll be more to the point. Unless you can find
permission to take a deduction, then it is not allowed.

Deductions are ours to take "by the grace of Congress.)

Cheer$$,
Harlan Lunsford, EA n LA

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- quote -

Since you were looking at Pub 970, you already had the
"bible" for determining Education Expense tax allowances.
I'm not sure exactly which option you were pursuing. But
let's assume the Lifetime Learning Credit -- since tax
credits are usually worth more, and preferred over
"Adjustments to Income."

Under Qualified Tuition and Related Expenses, it clearly
states they include "fees required for enrollment at an
eligible educational institution." That would be enough for
me to conclude that "application fees and expenses required
to enroll" are covered.

A reasonably prudent man could reach that conclusion, so why
push harder?

Bill

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- quote -

I am not a tax attorney but this doesn't sound like a great
explanation to me. Anyone else who might have more
information?

Please comment...

Thanks very much.

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Ted Simon wrote:

- quote -

Do not dwell on whether or not it says no; but instead ask,
"does it say you may?

Cheer$$,
Harlan Lunsford, EA n LA

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I will be enrolling in an MBA program starting this year (I
am an engineer). I was told that I am not allowed to deduct
my application expenses for these programs (totalled almost
$1000) for 2003. Having looked at the IRS Pub 970, I cannot
find where it says that these application fees are not
deductible.

IRS Pub 970 says "Qualified education expenses are tuition
and certain related expenses required for enrollment or
attendance at an eligible academic institution."

IMO, application fees are certainly required for enrollment
and attendance in a program - why can I not deduct these
fees?

Thanks,
Josh

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