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#11
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| D. Stussy" <kd6lvw[at]bde-arc.ampr.org> wrote: - quote - > Ron Rosenfeld wrote:
Well, what you write makes sense to me, but it is contrary> > Wayne Brasch" <waynebrasch[at]stowetel.com> wrote: > > > The fact that the check was properly mailed in 2003 makes it > > > income to the contractor in 2003 under the rule of > > > constructive receipt. > > What does "properly mailed" mean? > I think that is obvious: Properly addressed and with > sufficient postage. > > I am a cash basis tax payer and had a rent check mailed to > > me. The postmark on the envelope is 12/31/03. I did not > > receive it until 1/2/04. There is no way that the proceeds > > could have been available to me on 12/31/03 as they were in > > a post office hundreds of miles away! > > > Shouldn't I be reporting this income in 2004? > Postmark on 12/31 -> mailed on 12/31, which means that > delivery will be on the next [postal business] day, 1/2. > The recipient does NOT have constructive receipt unless it > was mailed because he failed to appear to pick it up. to what WB wrote, which is why I asked my question. --ron << -------------------------------------------------> << The Charter and the Guidelines for submitting > << messages to this newsgroup are at www.asktax.org > << -------------------------------------------------> |
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#10
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| Ron Rosenfeld wrote: - quote - > Wayne Brasch" <waynebrasch[at]stowetel.com> wrote:
I think that is obvious: Properly addressed and with> > The fact that the check was properly mailed in 2003 makes it > > income to the contractor in 2003 under the rule of > > constructive receipt. > What does "properly mailed" mean? sufficient postage. - quote - > I am a cash basis tax payer and had a rent check mailed to
Postmark on 12/31 -> mailed on 12/31, which means that> me. The postmark on the envelope is 12/31/03. I did not > receive it until 1/2/04. There is no way that the proceeds > could have been available to me on 12/31/03 as they were in > a post office hundreds of miles away! > Shouldn't I be reporting this income in 2004? delivery will be on the next [postal business] day, 1/2. The recipient does NOT have constructive receipt unless it was mailed because he failed to appear to pick it up. << -------------------------------------------------> << The Charter and the Guidelines for submitting > << messages to this newsgroup are at www.asktax.org > << -------------------------------------------------> |
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#9
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| Wayne Brasch wrote: - quote - > ... Chances are
When the work was done doesn't matter. The 1099 reports> the work was done in 2003 and should be put on a 2003 Form > 1099MISC by the company. only the year the payment is SENT. - quote - > The fact that the contractor gets
No, it doesn't. If the contractor is on the cash basis,> the check in 2004 doesn't really matter. What you read in > Publication 334 about the cash receipts method is correct, > but the money was properly earned by the contractor in 2003. > The fact that the check was properly mailed in 2003 makes it > income to the contractor in 2003 under the rule of > constructive receipt. then when he COULD HAVE received the check is relevant. Assuming the contractor didn't have the option of picking up the check (making in constructive receipt in 2003), the money is only income when it reaches his mailbox. (If he has a PO Box, and doesn't check it until January 2, that's another matter.) << -------------------------------------------------> << The Charter and the Guidelines for submitting > << messages to this newsgroup are at www.asktax.org > << -------------------------------------------------> |
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#8
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| Arthur L. Rubin wrote: (snipped ) - quote - > Also consider that the company cannot KNOW whether the check
All this discussion puts me in mind of one of my suppliers> was ACTUALLY received until the check clears, which is > usually a few days after it was received. The year of > receipt is not known unless the check actually clears in > that year. (printer and copier toner). I decided to stock up before tax season, so went by his place Dec 23rd or thereabouts and picked the cartridges up. I didn't bring a check with me, but did mail him one the next day. While closing the year out yesterday I checked my bank online and the only check that had not cleared was his. I know he must have gotten it, since the USPS is good about city delivery around these parts anyway. So I'm wondering, did he get it and is not cashing it until this year on purpose? Does he even KNOW what constructive receipt really means? Happy New Cheer$, Harlan Lunsford, EA n LA << -------------------------------------------------> << The Charter and the Guidelines for submitting > << messages to this newsgroup are at www.asktax.org > << -------------------------------------------------> |
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#7
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| Wayne Brasch wrote: - quote - > First of all, let me remind you that no IRS publication
Wayne, under the facts he stated, he did not receive the> contains the tax law. They are interpretations of the law > by the IRS. The situation you ask about here is in what > year was the work performed by the contractor? Chances are > the work was done in 2003 and should be put on a 2003 Form > 1099MISC by the company. The fact that the contractor gets > the check in 2004 doesn't really matter. What you read in > Publication 334 about the cash receipts method is correct, > but the money was properly earned by the contractor in 2003. > The fact that the check was properly mailed in 2003 makes it > income to the contractor in 2003 under the rule of > constructive receipt. The company can possibly deduct the > expenditure on their 2003 return while the contractor > reports that income on his 2003 return as well despite the > fact that he doesn't physically get the check until 2004. check, until tax year 2004. Nowhere did he indicate that the check was made available to him in 2003, nor that the contractor had telephoned him to say "come get your check", or even that they were in the same town. If someone in another city calls me on Dec 31st and says he has my check ready, distance alone precludes my coming to pick it up, and therefore I am not in constructive receipt of it. Happy New Cheer$, Harlan Lunsford, EA n LA << -------------------------------------------------> << The Charter and the Guidelines for submitting > << messages to this newsgroup are at www.asktax.org > << -------------------------------------------------> |
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#6
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| Wayne Brasch" <waynebrasch[at]stowetel.com> wrote: - quote - > The fact that the check was properly mailed in 2003 makes it
What does "properly mailed" mean?> income to the contractor in 2003 under the rule of > constructive receipt. I am a cash basis tax payer and had a rent check mailed to me. The postmark on the envelope is 12/31/03. I did not receive it until 1/2/04. There is no way that the proceeds could have been available to me on 12/31/03 as they were in a post office hundreds of miles away! Shouldn't I be reporting this income in 2004? --ron << -------------------------------------------------> << The Charter and the Guidelines for submitting > << messages to this newsgroup are at www.asktax.org > << -------------------------------------------------> |
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#5
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| John Caruso wrote: - quote - > However, my question is from the company's side: should the
Section 6041(a) provides:> check be included in the contractor's 1099-MISC for 2003, or > 2004? "(a) Payments of $600 or more. All persons engaged in a trade or business and making payment in the course of such trade or business to another person, of rent, salaries, wages, premiums, annuities, compensations, remunerations, emoluments, or other fixed or determinable gains, profits, and income (other than payments to which section 6042(a)(1) , 6044(a)(1) , 6047(e) , 6049(a) , or 6050N(a) applies, and other than payments with respect to which a statement is required under the authority of section 6042(a)(2) , 6044(a)(2) , or 6045 ), of $600 or more in any taxable year, or, in the case of such payments made by the United States, the officers or employees of the United States having information as to such payments and required to make returns in regard thereto by the regulations hereinafter provided for, shall render a true and accurate return to the Secretary, under such regulations and in such form and manner and to such extent as may be prescribed by the Secretary, setting forth the amount of such gains, profits, and income, and the name and address of the recipient of such payment." Regulation 1.6041-1 makes it clear that the calendar year is the key, and the issue is payment *NOT* when the recipient receives it or cashes the check. Remember, the payor really can't know for sure when the amount would be includible in the recipient's income--the date he/she cashes the check may not be the date it was received and, to be completely honest, the recipient may even be on the accrual basis. The 1099 puts the IRS on notice about potential income, but it is not completely dispositive. If the payor had to report in the year in which the recipient had to report, this whole issue would be a *lot* more complicated for the payors--as well as requiring the payor to be able to compel the recipient to provide a lot more information than merely an identification number. So the IRC merely bases the reporting on when it is paid. -- Ed Zollars, CPA Phoenix, Arizona << -------------------------------------------------> << The Charter and the Guidelines for submitting > << messages to this newsgroup are at www.asktax.org > << -------------------------------------------------> |
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#4
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| John Caruso wrote: - quote - > A company sends a check to a contractor on 12/28/2003, but
Actually, I would lean toward it being deductible from the> the check isn't received until 1/2/2004. The IRS is very > specific that if the contractor uses the cash method of > accounting, this check should be included in income for > 2004--not 2003 (the relevant reference is in pub 334, > chapter 2). > However, my question is from the company's side: should the > check be included in the contractor's 1099-MISC for 2003, or > 2004? company in 2003, and so should be reported on a 1099-MISC for 2003. Also consider that the company cannot KNOW whether the check was ACTUALLY received until the check clears, which is usually a few days after it was received. The year of receipt is not known unless the check actually clears in that year. But I can't give a cite. << -------------------------------------------------> << The Charter and the Guidelines for submitting > << messages to this newsgroup are at www.asktax.org > << -------------------------------------------------> |
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#3
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| John Caruso wrote: - quote - > A company sends a check to a contractor on 12/28/2003, but
It will come down to whether delivery before or on 12/31 was> the check isn't received until 1/2/2004. The IRS is very > specific that if the contractor uses the cash method of > accounting, this check should be included in income for > 2004--not 2003 (the relevant reference is in pub 334, > chapter 2). > However, my question is from the company's side: should the > check be included in the contractor's 1099-MISC for 2003, or > 2004? I can't find any references in IRS publications that > specify one way or the other. Based on the IRS requirement > that the contractor report the income in 2004, it seems > clear that it would have to go on the 2004 1099-MISC and not > the 2003 1099-MISC. Is this actually the case, and does > anyone have a reference (preferably an IRS publication) that > clarifies it? possible. << -------------------------------------------------> << The Charter and the Guidelines for submitting > << messages to this newsgroup are at www.asktax.org > << -------------------------------------------------> |
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#2
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| "John Caruso" <johnSPAMcarAWAYuso[at]myprivacy.ca> wrote: - quote - > A company sends a check to a contractor on 12/28/2003, but
First of all, let me remind you that no IRS publication> the check isn't received until 1/2/2004. The IRS is very > specific that if the contractor uses the cash method of > accounting, this check should be included in income for > 2004--not 2003 (the relevant reference is in pub 334, > chapter 2). > However, my question is from the company's side: should the > check be included in the contractor's 1099-MISC for 2003, or > 2004? I can't find any references in IRS publications that > specify one way or the other. Based on the IRS requirement > that the contractor report the income in 2004, it seems > clear that it would have to go on the 2004 1099-MISC and not > the 2003 1099-MISC. Is this actually the case, and does > anyone have a reference (preferably an IRS publication) that > clarifies it? contains the tax law. They are interpretations of the law by the IRS. The situation you ask about here is in what year was the work performed by the contractor? Chances are the work was done in 2003 and should be put on a 2003 Form 1099MISC by the company. The fact that the contractor gets the check in 2004 doesn't really matter. What you read in Publication 334 about the cash receipts method is correct, but the money was properly earned by the contractor in 2003. The fact that the check was properly mailed in 2003 makes it income to the contractor in 2003 under the rule of constructive receipt. The company can possibly deduct the expenditure on their 2003 return while the contractor reports that income on his 2003 return as well despite the fact that he doesn't physically get the check until 2004. Wayne Brasch, CPA, M. S. Taxation << -------------------------------------------------> << The Charter and the Guidelines for submitting > << messages to this newsgroup are at www.asktax.org > << -------------------------------------------------> |
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#1
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| John Caruso wrote: - quote - > A company sends a check to a contractor on 12/28/2003, but
The payor may indeed and will I'm sure send the 1099-misc> the check isn't received until 1/2/2004. The IRS is very > specific that if the contractor uses the cash method of > accounting, this check should be included in income for > 2004--not 2003 (the relevant reference is in pub 334, > chapter 2). > However, my question is from the company's side: should the > check be included in the contractor's 1099-MISC for 2003, or > 2004? I can't find any references in IRS publications that > specify one way or the other. Based on the IRS requirement > that the contractor report the income in 2004, it seems > clear that it would have to go on the 2004 1099-MISC and not > the 2003 1099-MISC. Is this actually the case, and does > anyone have a reference (preferably an IRS publication) that > clarifies it? for 2003 and take the deduction on it's own tax return. All good and proper. And as you already know, the payee doesn't have to report the income until the year the check is received. the problem comes in matching of course, and if the amount in question is not too terribly large, IRS will probably nevr bother him. But if it's significant, say... 10% or more of gross income, then I would attach an explanation to the 2004 return. Happy New Year, Harlan Lunsford, EA n LA << -------------------------------------------------> << The Charter and the Guidelines for submitting > << messages to this newsgroup are at www.asktax.org > << -------------------------------------------------> |
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| John Caruso <johnSPAMcarAWAYuso[at]myprivacy.ca> writes: - quote - > A company sends a check to a contractor on 12/28/2003, but
The proper year for reporting income depends on your method> the check isn't received until 1/2/2004. The IRS is very > specific that if the contractor uses the cash method of > accounting, this check should be included in income for > 2004--not 2003 (the relevant reference is in pub 334, > chapter 2). > However, my question is from the company's side: should the > check be included in the contractor's 1099-MISC for 2003, or > 2004? I can't find any references in IRS publications that > specify one way or the other. Based on the IRS requirement > that the contractor report the income in 2004, it seems > clear that it would have to go on the 2004 1099-MISC and not > the 2003 1099-MISC. Is this actually the case, and does > anyone have a reference (preferably an IRS publication) that > clarifies it? of accounting (cash or accrual). The majority of taxpayers filing Form 1040 use the cash method of accounting. Cash method taxpayers report the items of income in the year in which the income was actually or constructively received. For cash method taxpayers, the year that the income is earned is irrelevant. With respect to "actual receipt," if you receive an item of income that is paid to you by check, your receipt of that check is taxable to you as if it were cash. With respect to "constructive receipt," constructive receipt occurs when the income is made available to you. For example, you are in constructive receipt of income paid to you by check if the check has been cut and is readily available to you, even though you have not picked it up as planned. Also, you are in constructive receipt of bank interest when it has been credited to your account, even though you have not withdrawn it. If you are filing Form 1040 (PDF), it is unlikely that you are an accrual method taxpayer. Nevertheless taxpayers who use the accrual method generally report income in the year it is earned, billed, or received, whichever occurs first. References: Form 1040 (PDF) Publication 17, Your Federal Income Tax Publication 538, Accounting Periods and Methods HAPPY NEW YEAR - ALL!!!= ![]() "Jack" - John H. Fisher - TaxService[at]aol.com Philadelphia, Pa - Atlantic City, NJ - West Wildwood, NJ My Newsgroups & Boards at: http://members.aol.com/TaxService/index.html Where Ignorance is bliss, 'tis folly to be wise!= ![]() << -------------------------------------------------> << The Charter and the Guidelines for submitting > << messages to this newsgroup are at www.asktax.org > << -------------------------------------------------> |
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#-1
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| A company sends a check to a contractor on 12/28/2003, but the check isn't received until 1/2/2004. The IRS is very specific that if the contractor uses the cash method of accounting, this check should be included in income for 2004--not 2003 (the relevant reference is in pub 334, chapter 2). However, my question is from the company's side: should the check be included in the contractor's 1099-MISC for 2003, or 2004? I can't find any references in IRS publications that specify one way or the other. Based on the IRS requirement that the contractor report the income in 2004, it seems clear that it would have to go on the 2004 1099-MISC and not the 2003 1099-MISC. Is this actually the case, and does anyone have a reference (preferably an IRS publication) that clarifies it? Thanks in advance. - John << -------------------------------------------------> << The Charter and the Guidelines for submitting > << messages to this newsgroup are at www.asktax.org > << -------------------------------------------------> |
| Tags |
| 1099misc, income, reporting |
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