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#4
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| Michael T Wing CPA <mtwingcpa[at]yahoo.com> wrote: - quote - > Dick Adams <rdadams[at]smart.net> wrote: > > And that is no different than > > a lottery winner timing presentation of a winning ticket. > Hmmm... If you think that an invoice for professional > accounting services and a winning lottery ticket are items > of equal value and negotiability, I will gladly trade you my > entire portfolio of invoices for all of your winning lottery > tickets. <g It's a deal. There's no way your portfolio of invoices could be worth _less_ than all of my winning lottery tickets. Fortunately, you didn't specify "an equal face amount of" (or "equal present-payment face amount of"). (But I agree with your underlying point, that lottery winnings are essentially guaranteed when the winning ticket is presented, and a professional invoice carries only a hope (often a very good one) of payment.) Seth << -------------------------------------------------> << The Charter and the Guidelines for submitting > << messages to this newsgroup are at www.asktax.org > << -------------------------------------------------> |
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#3
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| Dick Adams <rdadams[at]smart.net> wrote: - quote - > And that is no different than
Hmmm... If you think that an invoice for professional> a lottery winner timing presentation of a winning ticket. accounting services and a winning lottery ticket are items of equal value and negotiability, I will gladly trade you my entire portfolio of invoices for all of your winning lottery tickets. <g MTW << -------------------------------------------------> << The Charter and the Guidelines for submitting > << messages to this newsgroup are at www.asktax.org > << -------------------------------------------------> |
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#2
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| Dick Adams wrote: - quote - > > However, if the taxpayer sat on a winning ticket for many
They do. However, as Albert Strangi's estate discovered, a> > months because he/she knew rates were going to drop, then > > the court is just as likely going to dig for a rationale > > to get the income taxed at the higher rates. > Taxpayers have a right to manage their affairs. How often > have you delayed billing a client so the income would go > into the next year? judge (Judge Cohen to be precise) doesn't necessarily have to respect how you arranged those affairs <grin> . - quote - > > As I recall the cases in question, the matter involved an
The issue here is one of smell. Since a smell case, by> > issue of a couple of days and, in at least one of the > > cases, it was the *TAXPAYER* who was trying to assert > > constructive receipt because it turns out being taxed in > > the earlier year worked out better. .... > The general rule is that the taxpayer wants to assert > constructive receipt to a year that is 'closed' It is> the taxpayer who argues that constructive receipt occurred > when he won the money not when he received it. It is the > IRS who argues the TP did not have constructive receipt in > the earlier year. Paul Hornung had three issues before the > Tax Court. Two dealt with constructive receipt. The more > notable one was the 1962 Corvette he received as the MVP of > the 1961 NFL Championship game. The other was the mink coat > the Packers gave his mother as a bonus for winning the > Divisional title in 1961 (Coats were given to the wives of > players who were married and to the mothers of the others). > The Tax Court said Hornung made no effort to get possession > of the Corvette in 1961, he got possession in 1962, and thus > he did not have constructive receipt in 1961. On the coat > issue, they noted that since his mother had actual receipt > of the coat in 1961, there was no reason to discuss > constructive receipt. What could be clearer?? definition, is always a case of a "facts and circumstances" and the court always has the ability to fall back on the "economic benefit" doctrine when the technical construction of constructive receipt doesn't work. Since such concepts can be "fluid" it wouldn't be terribly surprising to see the concept expanded if a court felt a taxpayer actually had the right to the funds and was taking action to dodge the tax for an extended period of time. I don't see a major problem if a taxpayer has a *minor* time delay in getting the funds. But if a taxpayer delays for a long period of time in going after the funds because he/she "knows" the funds are good (there's no real risk of default if he delays), then I could see a court deciding this is the functional equivalent of the cases that involved the use of trusts or similar methods of holding funds on behalf of the client. - quote - > Correct me if I'm wrong (and I know you will <g> ), but given
Note that in the economic benefit cases (which is a distinct> a 'smell test' is the reconciliation of form and substance, > constructive receipt is a 'smell test'. It tests the > taxpayer's direct access to the underlying funds. doctrine from constructive receipt), the taxpayer does *not* need to have access to the underlying funds. Rather, the issue becomes if the interest can be valued and if the funds are "protected" in some fashion. Traditionally that protection has required setting aside the funds in trust, but give a judge a bad fact situation (taxpayer clearly sitting on the funds for months to get a lower rate) and I would suggest the judge might find the "functional equivalent" of a trust. In the current climate (where the courts are now turning away from hyper-technical decisions that come out in favor of various tax shelters), I wouldn't bet my life that a) a judge wouldn't go for some method of stretching economic benefit to cover a case where the judge felt the taxpayer was "gaming" the system and b) that the same judge's decision wouldn't be sustained on appeal. -- Ed Zollars, CPA Phoenix, Arizona << -------------------------------------------------> << The Charter and the Guidelines for submitting > << messages to this newsgroup are at www.asktax.org > << -------------------------------------------------> |
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#1
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| "Ed Zollars, CPA" <ezollar[at]mindspring.com> Dick Adams wrote: - quote - > > It's covered in Section 451. The taxpayer has to be able
It's always amazed me that we would disagree on this issue.> > to draw against it for constructive receipt to exist. > We have disagreed a bit on this one <grin> . My own take > is, to be honest, it's going to be a "smell test" case. > If the judge has the opinion that the IRS is being overly > picky (winner won on December 31 a half hour before the > lottery office closed, but rates dropped January 1) the > court is likely to be swayed by your issue. But you seem to have specific issues with different people. So if not this one, then which other one could it be? <G - quote - > However, if the taxpayer sat on a winning ticket for many
Taxpayers have a right to manage their affairs. How often> months because he/she knew rates were going to drop, then > the court is just as likely going to dig for a rationale > to get the income taxed at the higher rates. have you delayed billing a client so the income would go into the next year? - quote - > As I recall the cases in question, the matter involved an
The general rule is that the taxpayer wants to assert> issue of a couple of days and, in at least one of the > cases, it was the *TAXPAYER* who was trying to assert > constructive receipt because it turns out being taxed in > the earlier year worked out better. .... constructive receipt to a year that is 'closed' It isthe taxpayer who argues that constructive receipt occurred when he won the money not when he received it. It is the IRS who argues the TP did not have constructive receipt in the earlier year. Paul Hornung had three issues before the Tax Court. Two dealt with constructive receipt. The more notable one was the 1962 Corvette he received as the MVP of the 1961 NFL Championship game. The other was the mink coat the Packers gave his mother as a bonus for winning the Divisional title in 1961 (Coats were given to the wives of players who were married and to the mothers of the others). The Tax Court said Hornung made no effort to get possession of the Corvette in 1961, he got possession in 1962, and thus he did not have constructive receipt in 1961. On the coat issue, they noted that since his mother had actual receipt of the coat in 1961, there was no reason to discuss constructive receipt. What could be clearer?? - quote - > I think there's always a risk of falling "too much" in
Correct me if I'm wrong (and I know you will <g> ), but given> love with technical readings of the law while totally > avoiding the smell issues. ..... a 'smell test' is the reconciliation of form and substance, constructive receipt is a 'smell test'. It tests the taxpayer's direct access to the underlying funds. Try this scenario: 31 December 1982 was a Monday. I had three things to do that day. First I stopped at a client for the sole purpose of handing them my invoice for the month of December. I could have given them my invoice on the previous Wednesday when I was in their office, but I did not want the income in 1982. I received payment later that week. No way did I have constructive receipt in 1982. And that is no different than a lottery winner timing presentation of a winning ticket. Second I went to another client where I put in a very long day to finish a project by year end and handed them an invoice at approximately 10:30pm. To my surprise the second client paid me immediately upon receipt of the invoice. Since a check is a negotiable financial instrument, like it or not I had constuctive receipt in 1982 even though there was barely more than one hour left in the year. Third I went to a New Year's Eve party. But there was nobody there to whom I owed any money <G> . Dick << -------------------------------------------------> << The Charter and the Guidelines for submitting > << messages to this newsgroup are at www.asktax.org > << -------------------------------------------------> |
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| Dick Adams wrote: - quote - > It's covered in Section 451. The taxpayer has to be able
We have disagreed a bit on this one <grin> . My own take is, to be> to draw against it for constructive receipt to exist. honest, it's going to be a "smell test" case. If the judge has the opinion that the IRS is being overly picky (winner won on December 31 a half hour before the lottery office closed, but rates dropped January 1) the court is likely to be swayed by your issue. However, if the taxpayer sat on a winning ticket for many months because he/she knew rates were going to drop, then the court is just as likely going to dig for a rationale to get the income taxed at the higher rates. As I recall the cases in question, the matter involved an issue of a couple of days and, in at least one of the cases, it was the *TAXPAYER* who was trying to assert constructive receipt because it turns out being taxed in the earlier year worked out better. Such cases have smell problems, since in the first case it "smells" as if the IRS was being unreasonable (the taxpayer had take extraordinary steps to get the money in the current taxable year) *OR* the taxpayer looks like he/she was waiting to figure out which year worked out best and then take his/her position (that is, if you *could* have received it prior to year end, why didn't you take it--and then the whole issue would be moot?). I think there's always a risk of falling "too much" in love with technical readings of the law while totally avoiding the smell issues. Much of the recent tax shelter activity is going after structures that do meet the literal technical requirements of the Code, but, as the large firms are discovering, the courts are willing to shoot them down either by invoking broad "overriding" concepts (economic reality tests) or by simply broadly interpreting other provisions to undo the deal. Actually, I think the Fifth Circuit's recent "discovery" that Section 2036(a) might be an issue in the FLP realm is somewhat related, though there it mainly shows that the courts are aware of how the winds are blowing <grin> . For many years the Fifth Circuit virtually automatically would reverse in FLP cases, so much so that we ended with opinions from the Tax Court that were appealable to the Fifth that clearly read as *if* the court was going to throw out the FLP discounts, but then allowed them based on a very technical holding(Kerr, for example) or a technicality (the issue of holding the IRS raised the 2036 issue too late in Strangi I). The Fifth Circuit, by reversing the Tax Court on the issue of whether the 2036 argument could be heard in Strangi pretty much indicated that they were now "agreeable" to that attack (which, in its most extreme form, would cause most problems for almost all FLPs), so the Tax Court has now written an opinion that lists a slew of reasons why 2036(a)(1) and (2) apply. I actually read Strangi II as kind of a game--the Tax Court is giving the Fifth Circuit a laundry list of 2036(a) reasoning and waiting to see on appeal which one (if any) they sustain <grin> . -- Ed Zollars, CPA Phoenix, Arizona << -------------------------------------------------> << The Charter and the Guidelines for submitting > << messages to this newsgroup are at www.asktax.org > << -------------------------------------------------> |
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#-1
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| "D.F. Manno" <dommanno[at]netscape.net> inquired: - quote - > William P. Brown" <wpbrown[at]longwood.edu> wrote:
It's covered in Section 451. The taxpayer has to be able> > Have there been any big winners between enactment of the > > recent tax law changes and July 1? If so, did the winner > > have enough sense/good advice to wait until July 1 or > > later to cash the ticket? > > > Disregard that. The 35% tax rate is retroactive to > > January 1. > If it wasn't retroactive, would waiting until after 1 July > have worked? Since you have the winning ticket and all that > has to be done to collect the prize is to file the claim, > aren't you in constructive receipt of the prize at the time > you learn you're the winner? to draw against it for constructive receipt to exist. While most prizes are paid out by authorized lottery retailers, large prizes (guessing $2,000 or more) have to processed by the Lottery Commission directly. Win on a Wednesday, show up on Thursday, and you might have a check on Monday - but maybe not until the next Friday. Plus, in most lotteries, you have 180 days to claim your winnings. Two constructive receipt cases worth reading are: Paul Hornung v. Commissioner, 47 T.C. 428 (1967) Lewis H. Ross v. Commissioner, 159 F.2d 483 (1948) << -------------------------------------------------> << The Charter and the Guidelines for submitting > << messages to this newsgroup are at www.asktax.org > << -------------------------------------------------> |
| Tags |
| $36, cut, extra, million, powerball, tax, winner |
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