comments inline.

"frustrated jeff" <anonymous[at]discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
news:048a01c3dbd9$7d0372b0$a501280a[at]phx.gbl...
- quote -

Who knows? These tools really are not much more than voodoo in terms of what
we know about them. It's probably not a good sign. Sure sounds like a scary
message, though. Was this from a current version of Salv?

- quote -

Gotta start somewhere. Keep copies of the original damaged M98 file and keep
notes so you know how to get back here.

- quote -

All of what you describe are real issues. If you delete the account, all of
the transfers get recategorized as transfer to/from deleted account. Then,
when you try to import the checking account QIF, you'll double these all up,
assuming that the exported account transfers refer to existing account names
in the importing file; given the way you are doing this, they likely will.

- quote -

Almost certainly for all of the reasons you are getting to. There is no easy
way to do this. But you still may be able to narrow things down short of
deleting transactions one at a time. Maybe a Transactions Report for the
account in question pukes. Then try customizing the date range to narrow it
down. Try the QIF export and then spot check it in Notepad. Maybe it's
really only half there? If you get a QIF, try importing that into a new,
otherwise blank, Money file and look see what you have. Maybe something will
jump out. Try querying out transactions from this account with MoneyLink.
Maybe some year's worth not produce the same balance. Maybe it'll puke.
Maybe you'll have to start narrowing the query date range to get it to work.
That could also get you into a narrower domain. You might try (again, in a
work copy of the file--I'm assuming you've got this technique down by now)
archiving off a year at a time and test after you lop each year off. You
could fine the year, maybe, this way. Of course, if you do find the year,
then you can archive months off. Etc. (Generally, I hate archiving, but it
might be handy here.) As noted in the FAQ, there is no one procedure when
you are out in these deep waters.

Good luck.

Dick, I hope you are still out there. I tried the salvage
utility and got the following message. "The repair
utility was unable to successfully salvage your file. The
file may be too deeply damaged or there may be a problem
with your current money installation. (0x800a1479).
Should that scare me?

I went into Money and sequentially deleted accounts from
money 98 and opened the saved file in money 03 until I got
over the hump. I have narrowed the problem account down
to the biggest one - my checking acount. When I remove
that account, the file size drops from 13 to 3.5 MB.
After removal and importing the rest of the accounts into
money 03, I have an active money file without the bulk of
my personal transactions. After reading stuff on your
recommended web site, I am concerned that exporting this
corrupted account without simultaneously exporting related
accounts that it feeds into will make the import a
problem. For instance, payroll information puts some of
each transaction in the checking account, as well as a
couple of the investment accounts. If I delete the
checkbook account from money 98, take the rest of the
accounts onto money 03, import the bad checkbook account
using the export/import feature, will the cross
dependencies be re-established so that the previous 9
years of transactions are not all screwed up?

If the problem is with a specific transaction or a series
of transactions, how can I find it. I am considering
deleting a series of transactions, but don't know how to
delete a group of transactions all at once instead of one
at a time. If I find the bad transaction, perhaps I can
repair it and take the whole kit and kabootle over at
once. Is this a better strategy than export import.

Thanks
- quote -

Comments/answers inline.

"Frustrated Jeff" <anonymous[at]discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
news:020601c3d245$dd56de60$a401280a[at]phx.gbl...
- quote -

Crashing is not not responding. It's crashing. That's different. Clearly
this is a bad thing that is not ameanable to patience. But at least now
we've eliminated one set of issues so can concentrate elsewhere.

- quote -

I don't know that M98 will have any particular bad karma with other apps. If
you install it on top of the M03 installation, I'd think this not a good
thing as M98 may not deinstall M03. I'd uninstall M03 before installing M98,
if that's how you choose to go. But bear in mind, M98 won't get any better
and is problematic to begin with and things like the floppy-spanning backup
patch and other patches for it have disappeared from Microsoft's web site.
You probably ought to keep working on moving forward 'cause it ain't ever
gonna get any easier.

- quote -

The only decent recommendation is all of the steps contained in the not yet
posted to the web FAQ update http://www.bollar.org/msmoney/#Q115?. I'll
provide it here and then continue below:
---
Q): I thought Money files were supposed to be upward compatible. How come
Money[new] crashes when upgrading my Money[old] data file?
[Relevant to Money2003 (v.11) and up]

A): Most users find the file upgrade process painless. Beginning with M03, a
significant number of users don't. For these users, a range of outcomes from
Money just crashing to misleading error messages about the file being
read-only to missing data in the upgrade file result instead. The exact
reasons for this are unclear, but it would appear that the upgrade code has
become much less tolerant to "damaged" files. (Here a "damaged" file means a
file that has somehow become inconsistent with itself or not conforming to
the "normal" structure. Here "somehow" generally seems to be by Money
itself, though things like End Task when the CPU shows 100% use by Money and
the application is reported as not responding "just because" Money is slow
and non-responsive may also be factors.)

The workarounds identified include:

- Many users have found success by running the msmoney -s repair technique
on the original data file from the original version then upgrading the
repaired file. For people who have nothing left of the original version
besides a set of backup floppies, this is not an option.

- Using the salv.exe repair tool from the newer version or from Microsoft
Support on the data file before upgrading then upgrading the repaired file.
As above, this method does not work with .MBF files or with .MBF files
spread across multiple floppy disks.

(For more information of the repair tools and file corruption in general,
see "I think my file has been corrupted. How do I tell? What do I do then?")

- Some users have found/and or been advised by Microsoft Support that an
intermediate upgrade through, say, M02, first solved the problem. Of course,
finding a CD of M02 can be difficult.

- Some users have ended up resorting to QIF Export/Import to get the data
out of the old version and into the new version as a better choice than
losing all of their data completely. This is a last resort.

- Some files that could not upgrade in M03 can upgrade in M04.

Note that several of these methods do not apply if all you have is backup
floppies or files. This is one reason that we always recommend upgrading by
moving the entire original .MNY data file rather than going through the
backup/restore process.

Finally, note that it is probably a good idea to confirm your installation
of the new version of Money is good before going down any of these paths. To
do this, open the Sample data file located in the Program Files\Microsoft
Money directory or try to create a new file.
---
I'm still thinking your best bet is the intermediate upgrade or maybe
several, assuming the current salv.exe played against your M98 .MNY file or
msmoney -s on the M98 side doesn't change your situation. Export/import
would be all that was left, but it is very problematic and will leave much
data behind. (Loan accounts, to name one, do not export to QIF.)

Good luck.

Dick - you are very helpful.

I took your advice and left the program up over night.
The Money program hung up, then shut itself down, asked
permission to send an error message to Gates and went
away. I appreciate that you think it is a patience thing,
but the program is simply getting mired down some where
along the line.

I was considering installing the 98 version in the XP
environment and just staying with the older version of
Money until I read your comments about how buggy it is.
Now I'm concerned about how much havoc it will wreak on
the XP computer and other programs there, including
the "better" Money 03. Any advice on that topic?

If all of these steps don't produce fruit, what do you
recommend for the best way to get information from the 98
version to 03 without using the original file? Export
each account one at a time? I'm all ears.
- quote -

"Stops responding" can be a matter of minutes (or hours, depending on what
you are doing) of very slow performance. How long are you waiting? If you
say less than overnight on a file upgrade, I say wait longer. If you say
less than, say, ten minutes on some things like entering budget planner or
tax estimator, I say wait longer. If you say less than, say, two minutes on
marking a transaction reconciled or entering a new transaction, I say wait
longer. I'm not defending this as good or appropriate or even acceptable.
I'm just telling you the results of lots of experience and reports here.

As to undoing the effects of archiving, the best bet is to immediately go
rename the archive file and pitch the file with all of the stuff
removed--the archive file is a copy of everything before any transactions
were removed from the main file.

Why does a "corrupted" M98 file work in M98 and not upgrade to M02/03? Who
knows? Probably because M98 mangled something but doesn't care about it and
M02/03 are not so tolerant. M98 was the single buggiest Money version
ever--nothing surprises me where M98 is involved.

"Frustrated Jeff" <anonymous[at]discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
news:047f01c3d18a$8207ff00$a101280a[at]phx.gbl...
- quote -

By hangs, I mean it stops responding. The screen goes
white nearly white, with the blue border remaining. I can
right click on the Money tab at the bottom and close out
of the program (It gives me the not responding are you
sure you want to close message box.)

You can also call me impatient. I tried archiving
information while I was waiting for a response. Can I go
back and import the information and make it whole again?

Lastly, if my file is corrupted, why does it open and work
fine on the old computer?

Thanks for the help.

- quote -

So may things. Comments inline.

"Frustrated Jeff" <anonymous[at]discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
news:023801c3d17c$64301b10$a501280a[at]phx.gbl...
- quote -

Compared to what? That's really not all that large as Money data files go.
I'll cite a link later with some statistics on my file. (There is an update
to that data that should be available at that same link shortly, but isn't
here as I write this.)

- quote -

Define "hangs." This process may take half an hour or more and a lot of that
time may be hourglass/"not responding"/100% CPU time. Have you let it run
all night?

- quote -

See above. You might also try double clicking on the Sample file located in
the Program Files\Microsoft Money folder. If it opens faster and runs OK,
you can rull out (pretty much) the installation and the rest of the
computing environment and all that's left is a) it's slow and that's the way
it is, or b) your data file is corrupt.

- quote -

M02 and M03 share many of the same performance haracteristics--i.e., they
are not as zippy as M98.

- quote -

Likely not.

- quote -

Very few people have found archiving makes Money02+ appreciably faster.
Many, many, have found that archiving causes a lot more issues than it
solves and/or that it doesn't really do what they thought it did. I do not
recommend archiving.

- quote -

See http://www.bollar.org/msmoney/#Q7.

- quote -

In the worst case of corrupt source files, this may be the only resort. I'm
not sure you are there yet. At any rate, a perfect file in M02+ can be dog
slow. BTW, export/import results in LOTS of lost data like Loan accounts do
not export/import and all of the account details and online settings and so
on. This is a way last resort.

- quote -

Maybe. But see http://www.bollar.org/msmoney/#Q85,
http://www.bollar.org/msmoney/#Q4 and http://www.bollar.org/msmoney/#Q104
first. The information in the next online FAQ update (again, not available
online as of this writing) at http://www.bollar.org/msmoney/#Q115 may also
be of some relevance, but I'm not convinced of it from your descriptions
here.

I don't think I've ever quoted that many FAQ references in one post and I
didn't even quote any references on archiving!

Good luck.

I have Money 98 on an under performing Pentium II computer
that sees to be working fine. Our file is 13MB, which
seems large. When I tried to open the older file on a new
computer with XP and Money 03 pre-loaded, the Money
program hung up 1/2 way through the process. Now I have
intermittent problems even getting the Money program to
start up at all - it hangs up.
I thought I would out-smart it and intall a Money 02
version on my Windows ME laptop. The install went fine,
but I had the same problem when I went to convert the 98
file to the 02 file. I am at wits end.

Will opening a back-up version help me over this hump?
What if I try and archive some of the information to
reduce the file size? Why is the file so big? What if I
try the export function and trick the new Money program
into loading it that way. Do I need to remove and re-
install the Money 03 program on the XP computer?

Please help!!!!