Virtual accounts in Money 2004. Good idea or not? Opinions?

#6 09-12-2004, 12:15 AM

I agree except for use as savings goals, earmarked for specific uses. Money
is rather weak in that respect. If savings accounts allowed sub-accounts as
I understand Quicken does, it would be a significant improvement. IMO, it
would be valuable *only* for savings, not as a budget device.
--
Chris Cowles,
Gainesville, FL

"Dick Watson" <littlegreengecko[at]mind-enufalready-spring.com> wrote in
message news:%23efjvo2lEHA.748[at]TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
- quote -

> The short answer is that they are hard to make work because, as you note,
> they make it impossible to balance the real accounts.
> What this kind of "cookie jar accounting" really tries to do is a crude
> form of behavioral modification. It tries to prevent you from getting into
> the "I can't be broke, I still have checks in my checkbook (or cash in my
> pocket or credit available on my card)" mode of thinking.
> But the same thing can be accomplished in a more thoughtful way by getting
> all of the bills scheduled and getting the BP setup and using the budget,
> cash flow, and DRP tools as designed. These tools will tell you how close
> you are to paying the bills next month and how your spending patterns are
> this month.
> My $0.02 worth--as always, YMMV.

#5 09-12-2004, 12:12 AM

"Dick Watson" <littlegreengecko[at]mind-enufalready-spring.com> wrote in
message news:%23efjvo2lEHA.748[at]TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
- quote -

> The short answer is that they are hard to make work because, as you note,
> they make it impossible to balance the real accounts.
> What this kind of "cookie jar accounting" really tries to do is a crude
> form of behavioral modification. It tries to prevent you from getting into
> the "I can't be broke, I still have checks in my checkbook (or cash in my
> pocket or credit available on my card)" mode of thinking.
> But the same thing can be accomplished in a more thoughtful way by getting
> all of the bills scheduled and getting the BP setup and using the budget,
> cash flow, and DRP tools as designed. These tools will tell you how close
> you are to paying the bills next month and how your spending patterns are
> this month.
> My $0.02 worth--as always, YMMV.

#4 09-11-2004, 11:12 AM

DRP stands for debt reduction planner.

Jim

"Byron Followell" <byronfollowell[at]hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:026301c49772$dd775df0$a401280a[at]phx.gbl...
- quote -

> Thanks for your advice guys. Both of you are right that I
> haven't really used the budgeting features of Money yet or
> looked into any of the more advanced features. I guess it
> would be better to delve into this program and make it
> work for me as designed before I try to start tricking it
> into doing something else. I'm probably going to feel
> foolish for asking but what are the DRP tools you
> mentioned. I just don't seem to recall that acronym.
> Thanks to both of you for your two cents worth. Your two
> cents was exactly what I was looking for. Actually I think
> I'd already half-way talked myself out of trying this by
> the time I'd composed the original post anyway.
> Thanks again.
> - Byron
> > -----Original Message-----
> > The short answer is that they are hard to make work
> because, as you note,
> > they make it impossible to balance the real accounts.
> > > What this kind of "cookie jar accounting" really tries to
> do is a crude form
> > of behavioral modification. It tries to prevent you from
> getting into the "I
> > can't be broke, I still have checks in my checkbook (or
> cash in my pocket or
> > credit available on my card)" mode of thinking.
> > > But the same thing can be accomplished in a more
> thoughtful way by getting
> > all of the bills scheduled and getting the BP setup and
> using the budget,
> > cash flow, and DRP tools as designed. These tools will
> tell you how close
> > you are to paying the bills next month and how your
> spending patterns are
> > this month.
> > > My $0.02 worth--as always, YMMV.
>

#3 09-11-2004, 02:45 AM

Actually, I've done something like what you're talking about, on a smaller
scale, in my savings account. I have 2 accounts in Money so I know how much
I can actually access without dipping into that part I'll use for mortgage
escrow payments (insurance and taxes) at the end of the year. Since it is
only 2 accts, it's easy to add them and balance with my bank statement. I
set up a transfer transaction from checking to savings, and another from
savings to escrow. Works well for me, but don't know if it would for
multiple transactions/accounts a month.

"Byron Followell" wrote:

- quote -

> Thanks for your advice guys. Both of you are right that I
> haven't really used the budgeting features of Money yet or
> looked into any of the more advanced features. I guess it
> would be better to delve into this program and make it
> work for me as designed before I try to start tricking it
> into doing something else. I'm probably going to feel
> foolish for asking but what are the DRP tools you
> mentioned. I just don't seem to recall that acronym.
> Thanks to both of you for your two cents worth. Your two
> cents was exactly what I was looking for. Actually I think
> I'd already half-way talked myself out of trying this by
> the time I'd composed the original post anyway.
> Thanks again.
> - Byron
> > -----Original Message-----
> > The short answer is that they are hard to make work
> because, as you note,
> > they make it impossible to balance the real accounts.
> > > What this kind of "cookie jar accounting" really tries to
> do is a crude form
> > of behavioral modification. It tries to prevent you from
> getting into the "I
> > can't be broke, I still have checks in my checkbook (or
> cash in my pocket or
> > credit available on my card)" mode of thinking.
> > > But the same thing can be accomplished in a more
> thoughtful way by getting
> > all of the bills scheduled and getting the BP setup and
> using the budget,
> > cash flow, and DRP tools as designed. These tools will
> tell you how close
> > you are to paying the bills next month and how your
> spending patterns are
> > this month.
> > > My $0.02 worth--as always, YMMV.
>

#2 09-10-2004, 08:15 PM

Thanks for your advice guys. Both of you are right that I
haven't really used the budgeting features of Money yet or
looked into any of the more advanced features. I guess it
would be better to delve into this program and make it
work for me as designed before I try to start tricking it
into doing something else. I'm probably going to feel
foolish for asking but what are the DRP tools you
mentioned. I just don't seem to recall that acronym.

Thanks to both of you for your two cents worth. Your two
cents was exactly what I was looking for. Actually I think
I'd already half-way talked myself out of trying this by
the time I'd composed the original post anyway.

Thanks again.

- Byron

- quote -

> -----Original Message-----
> The short answer is that they are hard to make work
because, as you note,
> they make it impossible to balance the real accounts.
> What this kind of "cookie jar accounting" really tries to
do is a crude form
> of behavioral modification. It tries to prevent you from
getting into the "I
> can't be broke, I still have checks in my checkbook (or
cash in my pocket or
> credit available on my card)" mode of thinking.
> But the same thing can be accomplished in a more
thoughtful way by getting
> all of the bills scheduled and getting the BP setup and
using the budget,
> cash flow, and DRP tools as designed. These tools will
tell you how close
> you are to paying the bills next month and how your
spending patterns are
> this month.
> My $0.02 worth--as always, YMMV.

#1 09-10-2004, 07:11 PM

The short answer is that they are hard to make work because, as you note,
they make it impossible to balance the real accounts.

What this kind of "cookie jar accounting" really tries to do is a crude form
of behavioral modification. It tries to prevent you from getting into the "I
can't be broke, I still have checks in my checkbook (or cash in my pocket or
credit available on my card)" mode of thinking.

But the same thing can be accomplished in a more thoughtful way by getting
all of the bills scheduled and getting the BP setup and using the budget,
cash flow, and DRP tools as designed. These tools will tell you how close
you are to paying the bills next month and how your spending patterns are
this month.

My $0.02 worth--as always, YMMV.

"Byron Followell" <byronfollowell[at]hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:017c01c49765$6305ebc0$a401280a[at]phx.gbl...
- quote -

> I am a firm believer in the general financial lessons
> taught by Dave Ramsey's Financial Peace University. One of
> his techniques is the envelope system. You have different
> envelopes setup for rent or mortgage, groceries, clothing,
> electricity, etc; whatever you have on your normal monthly
> budget. Each paycheck you insert into each envelope
> however much you need to have enough to cover that bill at
> the end of the month or whenever the bill is due. This
> works great if you work with only cash but I usually don't
> cash my paychecks nor do I want to start keeping a bunch
> of cash lying around in envelopes around my home. I do
> almost 100% of my financial transactions through Microsoft
> Money. I pay most of my normal, monthly bills online and
> almost everything else is by debit card or check.
> What I was thinking of trying is to setup "virtual"
> accounts in Money to simulate these different envelopes. I
> put in X amount in each virtual account every paycheck and
> then, come bill time, put that money back into my real
> checking account to pay the bill. I can already see one
> problem with my account balance never balancing up with
> what the downloaded bank statements show. Does this sound
> feasible? Would it be worth the trouble? Can anyone think
> of any reasons not to attempt something like this? Will it
> likely cause more problems than it's worth? Is there maybe
> a better way someone's tried that would help me accomplish
> the same thing? Thanks for any feedback or advice anyone
> can provide.
> Sincerely,
> - Byron Followell

09-10-2004, 06:45 PM

I see what you are saying, but I do something similar with setting up bills
and looking at the forecasts. I know how much money I will have at the end
of the month after paying all the bills. If this doesn't work for you, I
used to enter all my bills into Money(as actual transactions and have the
checks sitting in a pile) and wait until the end of the month to see what
was left over to "play" with. This method did help me get out of debt since
I was always showing not much money in my bank account.

"Byron Followell" <byronfollowell[at]hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:017c01c49765$6305ebc0$a401280a[at]phx.gbl...
- quote -

> I am a firm believer in the general financial lessons
> taught by Dave Ramsey's Financial Peace University. One of
> his techniques is the envelope system. You have different
> envelopes setup for rent or mortgage, groceries, clothing,
> electricity, etc; whatever you have on your normal monthly
> budget. Each paycheck you insert into each envelope
> however much you need to have enough to cover that bill at
> the end of the month or whenever the bill is due. This
> works great if you work with only cash but I usually don't
> cash my paychecks nor do I want to start keeping a bunch
> of cash lying around in envelopes around my home. I do
> almost 100% of my financial transactions through Microsoft
> Money. I pay most of my normal, monthly bills online and
> almost everything else is by debit card or check.
> What I was thinking of trying is to setup "virtual"
> accounts in Money to simulate these different envelopes. I
> put in X amount in each virtual account every paycheck and
> then, come bill time, put that money back into my real
> checking account to pay the bill. I can already see one
> problem with my account balance never balancing up with
> what the downloaded bank statements show. Does this sound
> feasible? Would it be worth the trouble? Can anyone think
> of any reasons not to attempt something like this? Will it
> likely cause more problems than it's worth? Is there maybe
> a better way someone's tried that would help me accomplish
> the same thing? Thanks for any feedback or advice anyone
> can provide.
> Sincerely,
> - Byron Followell

#-1 09-10-2004, 06:38 PM

I am a firm believer in the general financial lessons
taught by Dave Ramsey's Financial Peace University. One of
his techniques is the envelope system. You have different
envelopes setup for rent or mortgage, groceries, clothing,
electricity, etc; whatever you have on your normal monthly
budget. Each paycheck you insert into each envelope
however much you need to have enough to cover that bill at
the end of the month or whenever the bill is due. This
works great if you work with only cash but I usually don't
cash my paychecks nor do I want to start keeping a bunch
of cash lying around in envelopes around my home. I do
almost 100% of my financial transactions through Microsoft
Money. I pay most of my normal, monthly bills online and
almost everything else is by debit card or check.

What I was thinking of trying is to setup "virtual"
accounts in Money to simulate these different envelopes. I
put in X amount in each virtual account every paycheck and
then, come bill time, put that money back into my real
checking account to pay the bill. I can already see one
problem with my account balance never balancing up with
what the downloaded bank statements show. Does this sound
feasible? Would it be worth the trouble? Can anyone think
of any reasons not to attempt something like this? Will it
likely cause more problems than it's worth? Is there maybe
a better way someone's tried that would help me accomplish
the same thing? Thanks for any feedback or advice anyone
can provide.

Sincerely,
- Byron Followell

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