On Oct 17, 7:55 pm, cporro <cpo...[at]gmail.com> wrote:
- quote -

For what it is worth, I meant the same, at least as best as "value"
can be measured by various stock and company fundamentals.

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AFAIC, even Warren Buffett borders on being a mere "enthusiastic
amateur" when it comes to understanding the machinations of the
market. The guy has much wisdom but he has also been burned like the
rest of us. What distinguishes him from many other amateurs though is
that he admits his mistakes. It's part of why he is among the best.
There are few others I would propose are professionals. Robert Shiller
and Jeremy Siegel come to mind, not that a PhD is sufficient to ensure
one is a professional when it comes to understanding markets.

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there isn't a section in the book about it. it's just something that
stuck with me from the read. i have a newer version and perhaps it's
in the commentary. i tried to find it quickly but couldn't.

i know the market is not rational, but i'm not talking about peoples
emotions i'm talking about a relationship between and price and value.
but i am just an enthusiastic amateur.

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On Oct 13, 1:31 pm, cporro <cpo...[at]gmail.com> wrote:
- quote -

Were the 1970s rational? The 1980s? Name a decade that was
consistently rational. (I suppose "rational" would be something like,
"stock prices rose steadily such that P/Es and some other fundamentals
stayed fairly constant.")

My point is that time periods less than about ten years will show
persistent irrationalities, and this is the nature of economics, free
markets, etc.

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cporro wrote:
- quote -

I don't think there is a section like this, at least not in his 1973
edition. He does, however, imply that one cannot blindly rely on stocks
beating bonds over 30 year periods.

-Will

william dot trice at ngc dot com

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thanks all. i'll check into these recs.

grahams methods not working since the 70's may be true. but things are
changing now and one thing graham talks about is these long market
cycles. there is a part of the intelligent investor where he talks
about bonds outpacing stocks for 30 years i believe. the conventional
wisdom is that stocks are always a better long term buy, but to a
person who is say 60... 30 years is probably the rest of his life.

i tend to feel that the market may have taken leave of rational rules
and thinking around the 80's. this is based on nothing more then my
spider sense. but if its true perhaps we are headed back to a more
realistic rational time.

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I would suggest Field Guide to Financial Planning 2008 by Donald Cady. It's
part of the Tax Facts series. Available on Amazon for about $40.

Jean Keener

www.keenerfinancial.com


- quote -

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On Sun, 12 Oct 2008 06:21:29 -0500, camgere[at]att.net wrote:

- quote -

I would be skeptical of any investment advisor - including the
esteemed Mr. B - who suggested that it was "easy to profit" from a
particular investing methodology.


-HW "Skip" Weldon
Columbia, SC

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On Oct 11, 9:25*am, Will Trice <n...[at]monitored.net> wrote:
- quote -

Buffett likes Benamin Graham and Philip Fisher. Two different methods.
I was referring to the book “The Warren Buffet Way (Investment
Strategies of the World’s Greatest Investor)” by Robert G. Hagstrom
(1994). One of the best investing books I have read. Unfortunately
the world is complex. Even if you stick to a dozen rules, there may
only be a couple companies at any one time that pass the test. No get-
rich-quick methods. Buying cheap is a contrarian activity, so you
better have loads of self confidence. At the risk of being annoying
let me give you the entire paragraph from Chapter 2, page 46:
“In 1984, speaking before students at Columbia University to mark the
fiftieth anniversary celebration of “Security Analysis”, Buffett
explained that there is a group of successful investors who
acknowledge Ben Graham as their common intellectual patriarch. Graham
provided the theory of margin of safety, but each student, noted
Buffett, has developed different ways to apply this theory to
determine a company’s business value. However, the common theme is
that they are all searching for some discrepancy between the value of
a business and the price of the securities of that business.
Individuals who are confused by Buffett’s recent purchases fail to
separate theory and methodology. Buffett clearly embraces Graham’s
margin of safety theory, but he has steadfastly moved away from
Graham’s methodology. According to Buffett, the last time it was easy
to profit from Graham’s methodology was in 1973-1974.

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camgere[at]att.net wrote:
- quote -

Do you happen to have a cite for this? I'd like to read the full
passage and understand his context.

Thanks,
-Will

william dot trice at ngc dot com

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On Oct 9, 2:31*am, cporro <cpo...[at]gmail.com> wrote:
- quote -

Bonds, Mutual Funds, and the Real Estate (Kiplinger's Personal
Finance) (Paperback) is a nice overview. It's so full of good,
sensible advice it's like having your mother next to you driving in
heavy traffic. I'm using my copy as a doorstop (no joke). $15 you
can't go wrong. Benjamin Graham is compelling for value investing. I
was all enthused until I heard a quote from Warren Buffett to the
effect that it's been 30 years since straight value investing made
sense. There are any number of stock analysts who do valuation for
you. It is one useful tool in your toolbelt. If you aspire to being
something other than a lifetime employee I recommend Robert Kiyosaki's
"Cash Flow Quadrant". One more narrow niche. Forget all the get-rich-
quick gimmicks. You can use financial statements to analyse
everything from a newspaper vending machine to IBM. Money pumps
through a financial statement like blood pumps through a body.
Good Luck!

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i'm looking to by a book with financial definitions, perhaps something
less generic and more informative then a financial dictionary. i'm re-
reading a benjamin graham book and i need a reference to keep things
straight.

i know there are many such books at amazon. what i'm looking to do is
buy a good one that is current. i know there are online sources but i
don't like to read at the computer.

thanks.

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