<g-groups[at]paul-melnick.com> wrote in message
news:1173637078.879466.285350[at]h3g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
- quote -

The phrase "tons of money" is misleading. No responsible financial planner
should be expected to deliver "tons of money" whatever the market condition,
and failure to do so certainly is not a shortcoming. A reasonable
expectation would be steady growth over a long period of time, with perhaps
a little better than average growth when the market as a whole is rising and
a little less than average loss when the market is declining. Frequent
buying and selling on the part of the planner, even just a few trades per
year, is a danger signal. One can ask "If this advisor is astute, then why
does he need to sell one fund and buy another so often? Why didn't he get it
right the first time?" If for some unusual reason frequent buying and
selling is actually in the investor's best interest (which is not likely),
it is the financial planner's responsibility to explain in advance why that
approach is desirable.

On Mar 9, 5:59 am, Brian <bkush...[at]snip.net> wrote:
- quote -

I have only one question. Is your planner making you tons of money
doing what he is doing?

If not, find someone else.

PaulM

"Charlie" <charlie[at]comcast.com> wrote in message
news:K-ydnUOJG6_4wW_YnZ2dnUVZ_qmpnZ2d[at]comcast.com...

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Here's another way to look at it: If you pay your planner to execute
trades, what you'll get is a plan that executes as many trades as the
planner can plausibly get away with--even if the planner tries to be honest
about it. You get what you measure. So you should be looking for a planner
whose only interest is in doing what's good for you.

Here's an article that puts it in perspective:

http://www.fundadvice.com/fehtml/inv...nd_of_adv.html

Disclaimer: The article cited above is written by a financial advisor,
partly in the hope that people will read it and become his clients.
However, the article does not specifically advertise his services. I am not
his client, and have no financial connection with him. I am recommending
the article because I think it's relevant and sensible, and because I think
his website is a useful source of free advice.

"Charlie" <charlie[at]comcast.com> wrote in message
news:K-ydnUOJG6_4wW_YnZ2dnUVZ_qmpnZ2d[at]comcast.com...

Get another planner or if possible manage your
- quote -

Indeed, taking a little time learning how to manage your own money is the
best plan. There is just too much danger in searching for someone else to do
it for you. Certainly there are honest advisors who can do a good job. But,
for a newcomer, finding an honest one and avoiding the dishonest ones is
like shaking dice. You have to learn something about finance and how
products are sold to make it better than a chance affair, so you might as
well learn some more and do it yourself.

You got it!! The planner is stealing from you this way. It does not
violate anything that will get him fined or in jail. If you ask he can
justify it. Fire him. Get another planner or if possible manage your
money yourself. DIYS is not really hard and the learning curve at worst
is not likely to cost a tenth of what is being swindled from you. What
you can learn in 15 minutes a week about investing will make you wonder
why anyone would let a third party mess with their money. Start with
stuff like Google Searches for basic terms like "stock investing" and
"discount broker". Amazing what can be found with little or no effort
and no idea of where you are headed. Cheers!!!!!!!!!



- quote -

"Brian" <bkushner[at]snip.net> wrote in message
news:lk12v2lt078vik3ub9m01mko09s0bte022[at]4ax.com...

- quote -

If this were happening to me, I would leave that planner immediately without
further discussion. It is possible to dredge up all sorts of convoluted
explanations as to why this could be legitimate activity on his part, but
the chances of it being purely and simply for commission-generating are so
much greater, that I would not bother to search for the truth, but would
find another advisor pronto.

On Mar 9, 1:59 am, Brian <bkush...[at]snip.net> wrote:
- quote -

What does he say when you ask him this question?

Don't be so quick to throw the baby out with the bath water. What you
complain about is called the "principal-agent problem" and it can
occur in almost any industry. The agent's measurement of success
(compensation) is not the same measure the principal uses (lowest
costs, maximizing share price, etc). The occurs in real estate sales,
all hourly employment, financial brokering, auto mechanics, medicine,
etc, etc.

The saving grace is thus: if an agent engages in "personal measure
maximization" long enough, it is eventually reflected in his and/or
the principal's performance and he is replaced. The problem takes care
of itself. Furthermore, the process speeds up as public awareness of
the situation rises (that's what Dateline and 20/20 are for). That may
be what is happening right now with this "planner".

The commission method of income generation IS subject to the agent-
principal problem, which is why most of us are moving towards fee-
based management (no commissions). I have clients still on a
commission basis (their choice) that we haven't traded since they
purchased the securities. Then again, we have fee-based clients that
generate no commissions but we rebalance quite often.

To the OP, its not a crime to make your planner explain himself. If he
has "discretion" over your account revoke it ("discretion must be
given in writing, by the way). When he wants to trade something, ask
him why. Make sure he accounts for taxes & fees in his analysis. If it
sounds shady, don't do it. You don't HAVE to take the advice.

In article <lk12v2lt078vik3ub9m01mko09s0bte022[at]4ax.com> ,
Brian <bkushner[at]snip.net> wrote:

- quote -

What exactly is your relationship with this person? If you have
given him the green light to trade your account, this may be
perfectly legitimate activity. In my case, I have the broker
give suggestions, and I nearly always follow them. You can
also require a broker to clear all trades with you before
making them, or request that they make no trades on your account
unless you request them.

One possibility is that the broker is taking advantage of you
by moving the money around simply to generate commissions. If
so, this is called "churn". There was a popular 1980's line
that goes "churn'em and burn'em" as a way to make money on
Wall Street. Any broker that does that is doing something that
is at least unethical, and likely criminal. Your best bet would
be to talk to the branch manager or the brach "compliance
officer" to get an explanation. If something isn't kosher, they
are the place to start.

-john-

--
================================================== ====================
John A. Weeks III 952-432-2708 john[at]johnweeks.com
Newave Communications http://www.johnweeks.com
================================================== ====================

Maybe this is the way you pay him. My experience with financial planners is
that they are only interested in making money for one person. Guess who.
"Brian" <bkushner[at]snip.net> wrote in message
news:lk12v2lt078vik3ub9m01mko09s0bte022[at]4ax.com...
- quote -

My financial planner who I don't pay directly keeps on moving my
investments around from one broker to another and everytime he does so
costs me fees coming out of old funds and into new.

What gives with this?

B