treasurydirect.gov web site goes frustratingly overboard for security

#14 08-17-2006, 09:03 AM

that's fine, unless they tell you there is no mark up. which is what
happened to me, despite my repeated and specific questioning on this point.

"704set" <704set[at]anywhereyouwant.com> wrote in message
news:et6dnWpsY8VjC37ZnZ2dnUVZ_q-dnZ2d[at]comcast.com...
- quote -

> Brokers are not non-profit organizations. They mark up the price. The
> broker sees a bond selling at 101 in the bond inventory, he'll mark it up
> to 101.5-102 then sell it to you.
> 704set
> "anoop" <ghanwani[at]gmail.com> wrote in message
> news:1155695456.706270.292610[at]m73g2000cwd.googlegroups.com...
> > > dapperdobbs wrote:
> > > I looked at the stuff for the Treasury Direct program a couple of years
> > > ago, and passed it over. The cost savings over a broker ($39.50
> > > commission), especially at low interest yields, is very significant ...
> > > but even back then, it looked like a lot of red tape. As I understand
> > > the program, it requires a bank account - maybe you could arrange to
> > > transact through your bank for stuff not set up for automatic rollover.
> > > Some brokerages do not charge any commission for participating
> > in treasury auctions.
> > > Anoop
>

#13 08-17-2006, 09:03 AM

"dapperdobbs" <GeorgeCFL[at]hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1155772731.019194.186990[at]b28g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
- quote -

> 704set wrote:
> > Brokers are not non-profit organizations. They mark up the price. The
> > broker sees a bond selling at 101 in the bond inventory, he'll mark it up
> > to
> > 101.5-102 then sell it to you.
> > A bank discount brokerage charged a $69 commission on a T-Bill
> discounted to yield $114. (They did that only once - I was under the
> impression it would be a $25 dollar commission. Makes sense to me ...
> lose an account over a $69 dollar commission.)

Brokerage firms do not make any money. They do it as a service to the
client as long as income comes in from other areas.

704set

#12 08-17-2006, 09:03 AM

"704set" <704set[at]anywhereyouwant.com> wrote in message
news:et6dnWpsY8VjC37ZnZ2dnUVZ_q-dnZ2d[at]comcast.com...
- quote -

> Brokers are not non-profit organizations. They mark up the price. The
> broker sees a bond selling at 101 in the bond inventory, he'll mark it up
to
> 101.5-102 then sell it to you.
> 704set

Only issues in the secondary market are marked up (buy) or down (sell). New
issues are not marked up as the issuer is paying. Some brokers (like Schwab)
charge no fees for electronic orders for treasury bills, notes and bonds
purchased at auction as a customer service.

#11 08-16-2006, 11:59 PM

704set wrote:
- quote -

> Brokers are not non-profit organizations. They mark up the price. The
> broker sees a bond selling at 101 in the bond inventory, he'll mark it up to
> 101.5-102 then sell it to you.

A bank discount brokerage charged a $69 commission on a T-Bill
discounted to yield $114. (They did that only once - I was under the
impression it would be a $25 dollar commission. Makes sense to me ...
lose an account over a $69 dollar commission.)

#10 08-16-2006, 11:49 PM

704set wrote:
- quote -

> Brokers are not non-profit organizations. They mark up the price. The
> broker sees a bond selling at 101 in the bond inventory, he'll mark it up to
> 101.5-102 then sell it to you.

I was talking specifically about treasury auctions (and to be more
specific, only those orders placed online). There is no markup.
I have verified this with a friend by buying the same issue; he did
it at treasurydirect and I did it at the brokerage and we both got it
for the same price.

I don't know why the brokerage offers this service but I'm not
going to complain to them about this. :-)

Anoop

#9 08-16-2006, 11:00 PM

Brokers are not non-profit organizations. They mark up the price. The
broker sees a bond selling at 101 in the bond inventory, he'll mark it up to
101.5-102 then sell it to you.

704set

"anoop" <ghanwani[at]gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1155695456.706270.292610[at]m73g2000cwd.googlegroups.com...
- quote -

> dapperdobbs wrote:
> > I looked at the stuff for the Treasury Direct program a couple of years
> > ago, and passed it over. The cost savings over a broker ($39.50
> > commission), especially at low interest yields, is very significant ...
> > but even back then, it looked like a lot of red tape. As I understand
> > the program, it requires a bank account - maybe you could arrange to
> > transact through your bank for stuff not set up for automatic rollover.
> Some brokerages do not charge any commission for participating
> in treasury auctions.
> Anoop

#8 08-16-2006, 11:00 PM

A $39.50 commission tells me he purchased the Treasury at the auction.
Treasuries purchased in the secondary are marked up but show no commission.

704set

"Gil Faver" <rowdy'sboss[at]xxyz.com> wrote in message
news:5krEg.251903$mF2.162390[at]bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net...
- quote -

> "dapperdobbs" <GeorgeCFL[at]hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:1155675563.867211.221870[at]m79g2000cwm.googlegroups.com...
> > > I looked at the stuff for the Treasury Direct program a couple of years
> > ago, and passed it over. The cost savings over a broker ($39.50
> > commission), especially at low interest yields, is very significant ...
> > but even back then, it looked like a lot of red tape. As I understand
> > the program, it requires a bank account - maybe you could arrange to
> > transact through your bank for stuff not set up for automatic rollover.
> don't forget that if the broker is buying after market, there is a price
> markup as well as commission. Brokers like to "not understand" this.
>

#7 08-16-2006, 12:50 PM

anoop wrote:
- quote -

> Some brokerages do not charge any commission for participating
> in treasury auctions.
> Anoop

Thank you - I do very little in bills and notes and believe it or not,
I'd forgotten that!

#6 08-16-2006, 07:11 AM

zxcvbob wrote:
- quote -

> I hate it. I sent them an email asking if they could at least put the
> "keyboard" in a qwerty configuration and they said no.
> It's supposed to prevent key loggers from stealing the password.

Actually it's to prevent key loggers AND mouse click loggers from
stealing the password. The virtual keyboard prevents key loggers. The
scrambled keys prevents mouse click loggers.

One helpful tip is that the keys are only scrambled within in each row
on the keyboard. For example, the top row of letters has to be some
permutation of QWERTYUIOP.

#5 08-16-2006, 07:08 AM

Gil Faver wrote:
- quote -

> I didn't need all that. Just account number and hunt and peck for the
> password.

ditto for me.

#4 08-16-2006, 02:31 AM

dapperdobbs wrote:
- quote -

> I looked at the stuff for the Treasury Direct program a couple of years
> ago, and passed it over. The cost savings over a broker ($39.50
> commission), especially at low interest yields, is very significant ...
> but even back then, it looked like a lot of red tape. As I understand
> the program, it requires a bank account - maybe you could arrange to
> transact through your bank for stuff not set up for automatic rollover.

Some brokerages do not charge any commission for participating
in treasury auctions.

Anoop

#3 08-16-2006, 01:25 AM

amigan wrote:
- quote -

> Have you tried to get into treasurydirect.gov lately? Not only do you
> have to put in your account, password (via an onscreen perpetually
> scambled keyboard that your hunt and peck at with your mouse) and then
> social security # - you
> have to put remember exactly what all of 10 security questions you
> answered when you opened the account, answer each one precisely and
> answer no more or no less than the number of security questions you
> answered way back when..AND you have to enter your answers into fields
> which display your typed characters as asterisks. Arrrgh!!

I hate it. I sent them an email asking if they could at least put the
"keyboard" in a qwerty configuration and they said no.

It's supposed to prevent key loggers from stealing the password.

But I just have to enter the account # and hunt/peck the password. Not
all the security questions.

Bob

#2 08-15-2006, 11:28 PM

"amigan" <mmedwid[at]gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1155574501.204347.238480[at]75g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
- quote -

> Have you tried to get into treasurydirect.gov lately? Not only do you
> have to put in your account, password (via an onscreen perpetually
> scambled keyboard that your hunt and peck at with your mouse) and then
> social security # - you
> have to put remember exactly what all of 10 security questions you
> answered when you opened the account, answer each one precisely and
> answer no more or no less than the number of security questions you
> answered way back when..AND you have to enter your answers into fields
> which display your typed characters as asterisks. Arrrgh!!

I didn't need all that. Just account number and hunt and peck for the
password.

#1 08-15-2006, 11:28 PM

"dapperdobbs" <GeorgeCFL[at]hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1155675563.867211.221870[at]m79g2000cwm.googlegroups.com...
- quote -

> I looked at the stuff for the Treasury Direct program a couple of years
> ago, and passed it over. The cost savings over a broker ($39.50
> commission), especially at low interest yields, is very significant ...
> but even back then, it looked like a lot of red tape. As I understand
> the program, it requires a bank account - maybe you could arrange to
> transact through your bank for stuff not set up for automatic rollover.

don't forget that if the broker is buying after market, there is a price
markup as well as commission. Brokers like to "not understand" this.

08-15-2006, 08:59 PM

I looked at the stuff for the Treasury Direct program a couple of years
ago, and passed it over. The cost savings over a broker ($39.50
commission), especially at low interest yields, is very significant ...
but even back then, it looked like a lot of red tape. As I understand
the program, it requires a bank account - maybe you could arrange to
transact through your bank for stuff not set up for automatic rollover.

#-1 08-15-2006, 08:15 PM

Have you tried to get into treasurydirect.gov lately? Not only do you
have to put in your account, password (via an onscreen perpetually
scambled keyboard that your hunt and peck at with your mouse) and then
social security # - you
have to put remember exactly what all of 10 security questions you
answered when you opened the account, answer each one precisely and
answer no more or no less than the number of security questions you
answered way back when..AND you have to enter your answers into fields
which display your typed characters as asterisks. Arrrgh!!

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